If you believe in god, you're an idiot...

[Mardur]

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[chtulu]

An easy way to explain why I am hostile to religion.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtC65lm4MGE

Basically, because I'm tired of people just using God to explain everything and people to use religion to manipulate people. But seriously, just watch the clip.

[Kassel]

Thank god for the Grammy, Thank god for the touchdown, Thank god for blowing up the enemy's sacred ground.

[Alawen Everywhere]

Do you understand that pathos and ethos are both parts of rhetoric besides logos? Your entire premise here is that logos is all that matters.

Most people in religion don't care about the dogma and they never read their sacred texts aside from hearing someone drone on about it once a week or whatever. Most organized religion is about socializing and community. Sometimes it's about a really charismatic religious leader.

Many people are much more affected by things like emotion, reputation, authority and tradition than they are by reason and pointing out their lack of reason is insulting to them.

Now can we talk about the giant turtle?

[chtulu]

Originally Posted by Alawen Everywhere [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Do you understand that pathos and ethos are both parts of rhetoric besides logos? Your entire premise here is that logos is all that matters.

Most people in religion don't care about the dogma and they never read their sacred texts aside from hearing someone drone on about it once a week or whatever. Most organized religion is about socializing and community. Sometimes it's about a really charismatic religious leader.

Many people are much more affected by things like emotion, reputation, authority and tradition than they are by reason and pointing out their lack of reason is insulting to them.

Now can we talk about the giant turtle?

I'd be ok with religion if it was all about community and helping others. But when those religions start asking their members to donate money to propagate against gay marriage, or lobby politicians into voting against pro choice and stem cell research, then I have a huge problem with it; and lately religion has really been poking it's nose in things that are not their business other than their own personal principals.

[chtulu]

Oh, and if anyone has the balls to ask about morality and atheism.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zSYos...eature=related

[Alawen Everywhere]

Originally Posted by chtulu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'd be ok with religion if it was all about community and helping others. But when those religions start asking their members to donate money to propagate against gay marriage, or lobby politicians into voting against pro choice and stem cell research, then I have a huge problem with it; and lately religion has really been poking it's nose in things that are not their business other than their own personal principals.

That's interesting and all, but don't be surprised when the (very numerous) members of those monolithic religions are insulted and don't like you.

[chtulu]

That's fine, they can be insulted all they want. Their beliefs shouldn't be anymore protected than the belief of someone's favorite basketball team.

[john_savage1982]

Originally Posted by Alawen Everywhere [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Do you understand that pathos and ethos are both parts of rhetoric besides logos? Your entire premise here is that logos is all that matters.

Most people in religion don't care about the dogma and they never read their sacred texts aside from hearing someone drone on about it once a week or whatever. Most organized religion is about socializing and community. Sometimes it's about a really charismatic religious leader.

Many people are much more affected by things like emotion, reputation, authority and tradition than they are by reason and pointing out their lack of reason is insulting to them.

Now can we talk about the giant turtle?

To extend this. When we consider science do you realize how much trust is placed in the findings of others? The scientific method is supposed to insure repeatability but tell me guys, what have you done to personally try and verify the theory of evolution? How many quantum physic experiments have you done? What makes the word of a researcher any more valid then the words of a priest? Because the "science" has been verified? By who? Why do you trust them?

Can you explain exactly, in detail, how a car works, and be able to build one yourself from just raw materials? A television? A computer? A steam engine? Did you drive a vehicle before you learned the science behind how a vehicle was constructed and how it worked? Not just the broad idea - every little tiny mechanism. Did you examine the source code for your OS before you used it and make sure you knew how every tiny part worked? If you do all this stuff then you're some kind of uber-man but for most people there is considerable implicit trust placed in scientific findings and the technology and consumer products that result from the findings.

Perhaps many of you are emotionally-repressed and secretly angry all the time but there is a very rich realm of experiences that can be learned from feeling. Especially in the US, people tend to think of and treat their body like some sort of slave to their mind, however, if you want to look at (science), our body is, for the most part, driving the mind. Concerning feelings though, what makes ones emotional experience of life any less legitimate then the light entering their eyes to create an image or vibrations creating sound? Is it because we can somehow measure and categorize these things that they are more legitimate? Does that seem right/feel right to people?

If you want to reduce human experience and living down to only the scientific facts then you'd be ignoring a large part of being human. Why choose to do that? Religion is largely an emotional experience - which is probably why many of you attack it - and unless you've genuinely experienced religion you're ignorantly attacking something that you don't understand. Look at this entire thread. Everybody here seems caught up in information like gods existence, the evils of the church, reasons why religion shouldn't exist, but nobody is considering how religion makes people feel. What some people call indoctrination and mind control, others call sharing a very beautiful and terrific feeling.

You might notice that the consequences of religion really isn't that different from the consequences of science technology. Nuclear technology can provide energy or it can level entire cities. Religion can provide aid and community or it can lead to murder and destruction. We continue to do science, why can't we continue to do religion too? Perhaps to YOU the benefits of religion doesn't out way the costs, but for many people the rich emotional experience that religion provides out ways the cost.

[chtulu]

What does religion give emotionally that a spouse can't, or a hobby or personal achievement?

Or do you mean it emotionally soothes people who are afraid of the unknown and/or death? Because I feel emotionally satisfied without believing there is a bearded man in space.

What does belief in an intangible super being give you that things in the real world can't other than a false sense of security when you're on your death bed?