Bandwagon Proposal Thread.

[Nirgon]

Originally Posted by Writ3r [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The "know-it-all" actually wasn't aware of something?!? the horror!

I know nothing has been posted or signed and you've had more than enough time to get things going.

I didn't say you didn't discuss anything (in fact, you've been doing a lot "discussing" disagreeing with everything). I said you have nothing to show for it (ironic/the horror).

[Kope]

Originally Posted by Nirgon [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I didn't say you didn't discuss anything. I said you have nothing to show for it (ironic/the horror).

I know you weren't responding to me and I'm sorry for quoting this in this manner, but there are things to show for it, just not publicly (Look at how these boards have exploded, a public discussion will get nowhere).

I promise you it is the intention of the debates to not favor a single party but to come to a decision the entire server can live with. It's not to stop TMO and IB/FE from raiding, nor is it to promote any single or group of guilds.

[Nirgon]

Originally Posted by Writ3r [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Don't put words or actions in my mouth, bro.

It's called an assumption.

I said you have nothing to show for it.

So, you don't have anything to show for it? Ok. Nothing to argue with my point.

[YendorLootmonkey]

I like that DA stalling is no longer a valid tactic (does having a character eat a Trak Touch with DA count as a "stall"... don't care either way, but lets address that up front.)

Still not sure the "no poopsocking" doesn't cater to guilds with alt armies, someone would have to convince me and others this isn't just "something that looks like a bone is being thrown but is really just playing to a certain guild's advantage."

Does this involve the guild council premise like the original TMO/FE proposal? If so, what guilds sit on it, how will the votes be structured, how does a guild establish representation to it, and what are the "sanctions" mentioned that guilds would be enacting on each other?

How does this scale to Velious so we're not right back at square one a few months from now? Note, I feel it would be fair for Velious to be a FFA for X months, but I am sure casuals don't want to wait for another Rogean-style intervention before they get some sort of fair access to Velious content after a certain period of time. I guess this part isn't as urgent and could maybe be tasked to the guild council prior to Velious release.

[Autotune]

Originally Posted by YendorLootmonkey [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I like that DA stalling is no longer a valid tactic (does having a character eat a Trak Touch with DA count as a "stall"... don't care either way, but lets address that up front.)

Still not sure the "no poopsocking" doesn't cater to guilds with alt armies, someone would have to convince me and others this isn't just "something that looks like a bone is being thrown but is really just playing to a certain guild's advantage."

Does this involve the guild council premise like the original TMO/FE proposal? If so, what guilds sit on it, how will the votes be structured, how does a guild establish representation to it, and what are the "sanctions" mentioned that guilds would be enacting on each other?

How does this scale to Velious so we're not right back at square one a few months from now? Note, I feel it would be fair for Velious to be a FFA for X months, but I am sure casuals don't want to wait for another Rogean-style intervention before they get some sort of fair access to Velious content after a certain period of time. I guess this part isn't as urgent and could maybe be tasked to the guild council prior to Velious release.

I'm sorry, poopsocking and alt armies are both bad.

Poopsocking created Huge Variance and Huge Variance created Alt Armies.

Fixing Poopsocking is a good thing.

[Alarti0001]

Originally Posted by YendorLootmonkey [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I like that DA stalling is no longer a valid tactic (does having a character eat a Trak Touch with DA count as a "stall"... don't care either way, but lets address that up front.)

Still not sure the "no poopsocking" doesn't cater to guilds with alt armies, someone would have to convince me and others this isn't just "something that looks like a bone is being thrown but is really just playing to a certain guild's advantage."

Does this involve the guild council premise like the original TMO/FE proposal? If so, what guilds sit on it, how will the votes be structured, how does a guild establish representation to it, and what are the "sanctions" mentioned that guilds would be enacting on each other?

How does this scale to Velious so we're not right back at square one a few months from now? Note, I feel it would be fair for Velious to be a FFA for X months, but I am sure casuals don't want to wait for another Rogean-style intervention before they get some sort of fair access to Velious content after a certain period of time. I guess this part isn't as urgent and could maybe be tasked to the guild council prior to Velious release.

No guild council other than to mediate disagreements, and prevent CSR petitions.

This proposal has nothing to do with Velious and it shouldn't. 3yo Kunark is in no way comparable to Velious.

[uygi]

Originally Posted by YendorLootmonkey [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

How does this scale to Velious so we're not right back at square one a few months from now? Note, I feel it would be fair for Velious to be a FFA for X months, but I am sure casuals don't want to wait for another Rogean-style intervention before they get some sort of fair access to Velious content after a certain period of time. I guess this part isn't as urgent and could maybe be tasked to the guild council prior to Velious release.

I think FFA is going to be more tenable in Velious, just due to the sheer number of targets and that mobs pop faster(<7 day spawns). I doubt that FE, IB and/or TMO will really be able and willing to lock down everything, because that would practically be 24/7 raiding. I think the heavy emphasis will be on ST keys, with other things more or less falling by the wayside.

[Alarti0001]

Originally Posted by uygi [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think FFA is going to be more tenable in Velious, just due to the sheer number of targets and that mobs pop faster(<7 day spawns). I doubt that FE, IB and/or TMO will really be able and willing to lock down everything, because that would practically be 24/7 raiding. I think the heavy emphasis will be on ST keys, with other things more or less falling by the wayside.

Not to mention 6 new gear farms. PoM/PoG/WToV/Arena/Manor/HoT.
Vindi is an 8 hours spawn. Velks will be largely untouched by the big 2 etc. Wuoshi will be an easily obtainable mob. WW Dragons drop good spells and decent items/talismans. OH and... Kunark will be largely open. VS goes to 3 days eventually. VSR is added, Bard Trakanon is added, Golem for Wiz epic is added. etc etc etc....

[Clark]

Originally Posted by YendorLootmonkey [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Still not sure the "no poopsocking" doesn't cater to guilds with alt armies, someone would have to convince me and others this isn't just "something that looks like a bone is being thrown but is really just playing to a certain guild's advantage."

[Alarti0001]

Originally Posted by Clark [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yendors blah.

There is not a guild out there that can out poop TMO/FE/IB. Not a guild even close to that. So if poopin was allowed on Tier A raids... You would't be those 3(the ones with alts). Not to mention FTE is gained from motivated pooper/trackers. How many times did TMO snag a VS fte with 3-5 poopers vs 15+ FE poopers. 4+?