monk ratios, primary and offhand choices

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Bcbrown offered to help you get longer parses. Why did respond so rudely to that?

You have been rude the entire conversation. You have also provided no data. Fix yourself first please. Where are those parses you did after the 2h change occured? You could post those!

[bcbrown]

Going back to your data. You showed 4999 damage / 30.67 DPS with the 1h setup, and 4883 damage / 31.5 DPS with the 2h setup and fist weaving.

The hand-to-hand damage across the two datasets is pretty consistent after accounting for the main-hand damage bonus. Average hit of 22.8 in main-hand and 14.8 in off-hand weaving. 1hb has 76 hits and 25 misses for a 75% hit rate, total damage of 2035, and a 26.8 average hit. 2hb has 53 hits and 40 misses for a 57% hit rate, total damage of 4319, and 81.5 average hit.

If the 2hb had the same average hit but a 75% hit rate to match the 1hb data, it would have 70 hits with a total damage of 5705. Leaving the h2h data along this would result in the 2h setup doing a total of 6269 or 40.4 DPS vs the observed 30.67 DPS of the 1h setup.


If the 1hb had the same average hit but a 57% hit rate to match the 2hb data, it would have 58 hits for 1554 damage. Leaving the h2h data along this would result in the 1h setup doing a total of 4518 damage or 27.7 DPS vs the observed 31.5 DPS of the 2h setup.

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by bcbrown [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If the 2hb had the same average hit but a 75% hit rate to match the 1hb data, it would have 70 hits with a total damage of 5705. Leaving the h2h data along this would result in the 2h setup doing a total of 6269 or 40.4 DPS vs the observed 30.67 DPS of the 1h setup.

Careful explaining too much or he might start to understand why short parses are so prone to error.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by bcbrown [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Going back to your data. You showed 4999 damage / 30.67 DPS with the 1h setup, and 4883 damage / 31.5 DPS with the 2h setup and fist weaving.

The hand-to-hand damage across the two datasets is pretty consistent after accounting for the main-hand damage bonus. Average hit of 22.8 in main-hand and 14.8 in off-hand weaving. 1hb has 76 hits and 25 misses for a 75% hit rate, total damage of 2035, and a 26.8 average hit. 2hb has 53 hits and 40 misses for a 57% hit rate, total damage of 4319, and 81.5 average hit.

If the 2hb had the same average hit but a 75% hit rate to match the 1hb data, it would have 70 hits with a total damage of 5705. Leaving the h2h data along this would result in the 2h setup doing a total of 6269 or 40.4 DPS vs the observed 30.67 DPS of the 1h setup.


If the 1hb had the same average hit but a 57% hit rate to match the 2hb data, it would have 58 hits for 1554 damage. Leaving the h2h data along this would result in the 1h setup doing a total of 4518 damage or 27.7 DPS vs the observed 31.5 DPS of the 2h setup.

Yeah you need to read my post more carefully: https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...&postcount=113 I showed the expected average assuming the same hit rate for both weapon sets. 1h still wins vs 2h without fist weaving (many people don't fist weave). Also in a single fight 1h has a better chance to be average or above average, as seen in the video, and I explained this in the linked post and previous posts.

You really need to start posting some data of your own if you want to prove me wrong.

[bcbrown]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Careful explaining too much or he might start to understand why short parses are so prone to error.

The part I find amusing is that it's the same thing as his original point about variance in small samples!

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by bcbrown [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The part I find amusing is that it's the same thing as his original point about variance in small samples!

Incorrect. The game you are playing is simply you will never agree that a parse is the "correct" length. When I've done longer parses in the past this nonsense was the same.

You should do some parsing yourself and show us how it's done!

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by bcbrown [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The part I find amusing is that it's the same thing as his original point about variance in small samples!

DSM has never been consistent. His whims flap aimlessly in accordance with whatever crackpot point he is trying to make. He’s also happy to cherry-pick whatever most conveniently supports … whatever crackpot point he is trying to make.

He flip flops a lot.

Some things never change.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

DSM has never been consistent. His whims flap aimlessly in accordance with whatever crackpot point he is trying to make. He’s also happy to cherry-pick whatever most conveniently supports … whatever crackpot point he is trying to make.

He flip flops a lot.

Some things never change.

The only consistency is your trolling and lack of data. You have only posted two parses that I know of on these forums. The Mage DPS excel spreadsheet screenshot, which you admitted was incorrect due to Gamparse not working well in groups, and a bad parse from your Paladin that you retracted.

I can only conclude you have no idea how to correctly parse data and provide it. This is why you don't do it, it would be too embarassing. Spamming threads until people give up is your only strategy.

[bcbrown]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yeah you need to read my post more carefully: https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...&postcount=113 I showed the expected average assuming the same hit rate for both weapon sets. 1h still wins vs 2h without fist weaving (many people don't fist weave). Also in a single fight 1h has a better chance to be average or above average, as seen in the video, and I explained this in the linked post and previous posts.

You really need to start posting some data of your own if you want to prove me wrong.

Looks like your conclusion is that in your parse the 1h setup performed above expected, the 2h setup performed about as expected, the 2hb setup beat the 1hb setup by about 2.6% of DPS, and you think this supports the position that 1h is better than 2h?

If your position is that sometimes, when you're lucky with 1h and unlucky with 2h, 1h is almost as good as 2h, then I have no disagreement with you.

[Snaggles]

When I have time to play I want to parse with a 60 monk using like velium 2hbs on Bloodmaw. Not for dps, but to verify with the same haste how many hit attempts are made more than my ranger who clearly doesn’t have triple attack.

Triple-attack isn’t guaranteed but it’s a factor to consider. Triple attack on a 2h is three substantial applications of a large damage bonus. It is effectively haste on the main hand.

Right now whatever napkin math model you use (mine is MH damage x 2 + Damage Bonus/delay) doesn’t take into account an extra swing. Especially when it’s 200+ instead of 50+. Even without fist-clicking, or whatever you want to call it, that’s a factor I don’t think we are tracking.