<Aftermath> to join AEGIS Alliance

[Hyjalx]

Unlike you Nuggie, I was actually playing in the zone during Velious and Luclin. I was a raid leader in Club Fu and I can 100% assure you, dragons were NOT rooted during Velious era. What happened after Velious has nothing to do with P99. You are talking YEARS and almost 2 expansions after the fact and are further proving my point.

They also weren't rooted during Luclin era (at least for a long damn time) when several of us were actually in the zone with farm crews. I was part of a channel I created named "Dozekar". We used this channel to farm Dozekar, Seru and Several NTOV dragons. We were killing Dozekar with 9 people in full Luclin gear and he wasn't rooted. Neither were the other dragons.

Arguing against this just proves you never participated. So again, why the hell are the dragons rooted during Velious?

[Teppler]

Is it completely fair to say rooting dragons has been a complete and utter failure at this point? It’s a failed experiment.

The object was to increase competition and make things less zerg’y right? If not, someone correct me and tell me what it was for.

It’s done the complete utter opposite. It’s destroyed any semblance of competition and has taken zerging to the next level.

I suppose the problem should been seen early on when Rogean talked about leap frogging being in bad taste.... but when the pressures on that is clearly the only way to win mobs. There was a weakness in the plan from that very moment when everyone realized the bottle neck there.

[Psyborg]

Originally Posted by Endonde [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

They could go the Old School Runescape route and continue to add new unique content in the spirit of the original game. It sounds a bit odd but it was a really successful strategy for the Runescape team.

I can see that down the line. I wouldn't oppose anything that is executed well.

[Endonde]

Originally Posted by Teppler [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Is it completely fair to say rooting dragons has been a complete and utter failure at this point? It’s a failed experiment.

The object was to increase competition and make things less zerg’y right? If not, someone correct me and tell me what it was for.

It’s done the complete utter opposite. It’s destroyed any semblance of competition and has taken zerging to the next level.

I suppose the problem should been seen early on when Rogean talked about leap frogging being in bad taste.... but when the pressures on that is clearly the only way to win mobs. There was a weakness in the plan from that very moment when everyone realized the bottle neck there.

Pretty sure the objective was to stop guilds from training the entire zone all over the place and force them to actually go experience the zone in a more classic manner, and that has been a success.

I think rooted dragons killed small guilds so I don't like it a ton, but it accomplished what the devs wanted to accomplish.

[Mblake81]

Originally Posted by Teppler [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Is it completely fair to say rooting dragons has been a complete and utter failure at this point? It’s a failed experiment.

The object was to increase competition and make things less zerg’y right? If not, someone correct me and tell me what it was for.

It’s done the complete utter opposite. It’s destroyed any semblance of competition and has taken zerging to the next level.

I suppose the problem should been seen early on when Rogean talked about leap frogging being in bad taste.... but when the pressures on that is clearly the only way to win mobs. There was a weakness in the plan from that very moment when everyone realized the bottle neck there.

So you want to go back to zone pulls?

[Teppler]

Originally Posted by Endonde [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Pretty sure the objective was to stop guilds from training the entire zone all over the place and force them to actually go experience the zone in a more classic manner, and that has been a success.

I think rooted dragons killed small guilds so I don't like it a ton, but it accomplished what the devs wanted to accomplish.

That's so odd though. A non classic change to make the experience more classic and in the process clobbered every guild that existed at the time of the rule change. That's a destructive mindset and not consistent. How about every other small thing that people are exploited that wasn't completely known in 1999? Why the exception in this case? It had to of been because of the guild atmosphere at the time.

But yeah, if this is what the devs want it like, it's hard to argue against.

[madiguz1215]

Originally Posted by Endonde [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Pretty sure the objective was to stop guilds from training the entire zone all over the place and force them to actually go experience the zone in a more classic manner, and that has been a success.

I think rooted dragons killed small guilds so I don't like it a ton, but it accomplished what the devs wanted to accomplish.

What small guilds are you/others referring to? There was really only one, maybe two (and not for very long might I add) that were competing on a daily basis. PS was already on the verge of trying to merge with another guild before rooted dragons were even a thing and BG is almost only in ToV during quakes. I think the one guild it hurt the most was AG, but even they struggled to gather a pull-team every week, and the way they were going would have been tough to sustain.

This talk of zerging is utter nonsense. A lot of the time AM brings similar numbers to Riot, and when they don't the numbers aren't far off, either. What rooted dragons has come down to is strategy, timing, and execution. Make all the excuses you want, but if you don't have motivated raiders and knowledgeable leaders you will fail.

[Mblake81]

Originally Posted by Teppler [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

That's so odd though. A non classic change to make the experience more classic and in the process clobbered every guild that existed at the time of the rule change. That's a destructive mindset and not consistent. How about every other small thing that people are exploited that wasn't completely known in 1999? Why the exception in this case? It had to of been because of the guild atmosphere at the time.

But yeah, if this is what the devs want it like, it's hard to argue against.

Build a better mouse trap, make a smarter mouse.

The players don't want to be classic. They want to evolve and grow in a static environment. This is a museum that is live at the same time. With people wanting the classic experience but they are leagues beyond it.

Don't want rooted dragons? ok. Don't want borderline exploit zone pulls that make playing a class pointless? (the pulls teams have a hardon) ok. You are going to need rules that say they can't. The rules would also be not classic. Some guy like Hyjal will be in here saying "Why is X rule in place when it wasn't in classic? omg I can't understand.." so whatever rules you put in place would be bucked.

The issue is these things were not being done during classic, some people say they were but its hearsay, so the classic in era developers never had to address people doing these things. These are done on P99 because 20 years later, expansions after Velious with knowledge gained, LOTS more time to try things as there is no rush before the next expansion here.

The game might be classic but the players ARE NOT. There is no developer team trying to recreate the classic era Hyjal so he plays the game like he did in 2001. If I am wrong about zone pulls, mage bots everywhere in the zone during 2001 classic velious era, multiple accounts for guild mates to log on to make things work.. then I will take all my comments back and STFU.

[Teppler]

Originally Posted by madiguz1215 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

What small guilds are you/others referring to? There was really only one, maybe two (and not for very long might I add) that were competing on a daily basis. PS was already on the verge of trying to merge with another guild before rooted dragons were even a thing and BG is almost only in ToV during quakes. I think the one guild it hurt the most was AG, but even they struggled to gather a pull-team every week, and the way they were going would have been tough to sustain.

This talk of zerging is utter nonsense. A lot of the time AM brings similar numbers to Riot, and when they don't the numbers aren't far off, either. What rooted dragons has come down to is strategy, timing, and execution. Make all the excuses you want, but if you don't have motivated raiders and knowledgeable leaders you will fail.

I suspect AM had a pull team pre rooted dragons that is head and shoulders above anything riot is fielding now, especially when kelz was more active. Is that not an incredible EQ skill? Is this not strategy, timing and execution?

Talking about skill in this case is silly when you are competing against a team that's been clearly burned and continually burned out by the rule change.

Imagine what happens to Riot now if some rule change happens where crews of 20-30 people complete in TOV. Would the guild survive that? Maybe in some form but you guys built yourselves to do something else. Every guild that was built prerooting was built to do something else. AM was able to adjust the best but even they are struggling because they were built to do something else for so long. The adjustment was destructive all over and underestimated by everyone clearly.

[Mblake81]

A huge nut for classic experience. How many have shunned the use of youtube, discord, Teamspeak, ANY OTHER organizing/communications tool save for something like AOL instant messenger and ICQ, the Wiki page as well?

2019 tools to straight over lord a 1999 game.