Senate Foreign Relations Committee votes to give President Obama the power to launch

[Daldolma]

Originally Posted by Stinkum [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

and stop saying that pakistan is in the middle east, this is probably the 3rd or 4th post you've said that in this thread. cringeworthy man, pakistan is in south asia, not even remotely close..

or are all brown people the same to you?

pakistan literally borders afghanistan and iran and is playing a major role in the conflict in afghanistan. clearly a part of the regional landscape even if you want to classify it as South Asia, which isn't inaccurate.

but yeah bordering nation "not even remotely close"

[Stinkum]

Originally Posted by Daldolma [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

pakistan literally borders afghanistan and iran and is playing a major role in the conflict in afghanistan. clearly a part of the regional landscape even if you want to classify it as South Asia, which isn't inaccurate.

but yeah bordering nation "not even remotely close"

so let me get this straight

because pakistan borders afghanistan (which is also NOT a middle eastern country) and iran is involved in afghanistan makes pakistan a middle eastern country?

this is literally the stupidest single thing i have ever read on this forum

i am cringing for you

[Daldolma]

Originally Posted by Stinkum [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

so let me get this straight

because pakistan borders afghanistan (which is also NOT a middle eastern country) and iran is involved in afghanistan makes pakistan a middle eastern country?

this is literally the stupidest single thing i have ever read on this forum

i am cringing for you

are you slow? read what i wrote.

it's a bordering country that's playing an obvious role in the regional conflict. yes, it is accurate to call it south asia. and no, it's obviously not geographically a part of the "middle east". the term "greater middle east" was coined for this reason, but it's ultimately irrelevant. the point is that pakistan is an actor in the regional conflict, which has expanded beyond the traditional geographic confines of the middle east

[Stinkum]

o ok so its bordering a country that's playing a role in conflict not located in the ME, therefore it is middle eastern

we got a genius over here

[aowen]

I do hate Israel, not all of the people in it, but certainly their policies and political officials. And if here you want to define bigotry as hating someone for the opinion that it's ok to kill and oppress people and steal land, yes I am bigoted against that opinion, because it's fucking insane and stupid.

Hmm, I wonder why we would need to give aid to the countries we fucked up? I am sure if you look at the allocation of said aid it would not be equal across the board. A bigger factor would be that what the aid is for. There is a big difference between military aid and the sharing of weapons (Israel), and aid meant for development and feeding people peanut paste. Israel just bought a bunch of choppers etc from us, essentially with our own money. Don't whitewash foreign aid, it makes you sound misinformed. Also, tons of money is funneled to Israel through sources outside the government. Little of this is relevant however, other than you saying we support other countries in the same way we support Israel, which is the stupidest counter-argument I have had the displeasure of hearing.

And to answer your hypothetical, I am sure many would be willing to do something like that. However, do you think I would agree with that decision? Do you think I agree with our funding of Mubarak, Saddam in the 80s, or any of the other crazies we fund?

[Daldolma]

Originally Posted by aowen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I do hate Israel, not all of the people in it, but certainly their policies and political officials. And if here you want to define bigotry as hating someone for the opinion that it's ok to kill and oppress people and steal land, yes I am bigoted against that opinion, because it's fucking insane and stupid.

Hmm, I wonder why we would need to give aid to the countries we fucked up? I am sure if you look at the allocation of said aid it would not be equal across the board. A bigger factor would be that what the aid is for. There is a big difference between military aid and the sharing of weapons (Israel), and aid meant for development and feeding people peanut paste. Israel just bought a bunch of choppers etc from us, essentially with our own money. Don't whitewash foreign aid, it makes you sound misinformed. Also, tons of money is funneled to Israel through sources outside the government. Little of this is relevant however, other than you saying we support other countries in the same way we support Israel, which is the stupidest counter-argument I have had the displeasure of hearing.

And to answer your hypothetical, I am sure many would be willing to do something like that. However, do you think I would agree with that decision? Do you think I agree with our funding of Mubarak, Saddam in the 80s, or any of the other crazies we fund?

in terms of military aid, israel ranks 2nd behind afghanistan, who got $10 billion. israel just under 3. egypt 1.3. and even still, it hardly seems fair to disqualify economic aid when you're talking about "support". the point is that we throw billions at lots of bad guys. whether it's used to subjugate or keep the masses in check, either way it's going toward ugly regimes that do ugly things.

and the alternative is withdrawing support. that might sound good on the surface, but then what? that support is our in. egypt has to at least consider our opinion because they're on the payroll. eliminate that carrot and egypt doesn't disappear, they just stop giving a shit about what america thinks

[Lojik]

Originally Posted by Daldolma [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

eliminate that carrot and egypt doesn't disappear, they just stop giving a shit about what america thinks

Not trying to troll here, but why should they give a shit about what America thinks anyway? Shouldn't they do what's in the best interest of their people?

[Daldolma]

Originally Posted by Lojik [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Not trying to troll here, but why should they give a shit about what America thinks anyway? Shouldn't they do what's in the best interest of their people?

theoretically, of course. but that's obviously not how the world works. "aid" is really just buying influence. in critical regions, we buy as much as we can. israel just more readily sells influence than most of the region

[Lojik]

Originally Posted by Daldolma [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

theoretically, of course. but that's obviously not how the world works. "aid" is really just buying influence. in critical regions, we buy as much as we can. israel just more readily sells influence than most of the region

I feel like in one sense you answered my question, but on the other hand I don't. Maybe I didn't really ask the right way, or I'm not really sure what my question is. I understand that naive notions of countries ruling in entirely in their self-interest are not really true, and that whoever is in charge will make decisions based on their interests or whatever special interests they cater to. But why should we "buy" influence from this country? How does it benefit the people of the United States? Does this make them less anti-Israel? It seems like us sending aid to them is to appease them slightly since we aid another country that regularly antagonizes the rest of the region. I find it hard to believe that if we had no presence at all in the middle east and stayed completely neutral in these conflicts that Egypt would take an anti-American economic policy.

[aowen]

Hahaha, I just looked down at the breakdown for foreign aid, nonplussed to say the least. Pathetic analysis. Military in Afghanistan and Iraq both got substantial packages for obvious reasons, namely so we can leave. Egypt got military funding (whoopsies now) in 2011 because it was the interim government, the other places primarily got development funding. Israel doesn't have stability problems, it has a dick-in-ass problem. You sound like a Reaganesque General ripper zero-sum realist billiard ball theory concert of europe crazy fuck. Why don't you go genuflect to the trinity of Kenneth Waltz, Hobbes, and Kissinger.