So what's there to do in Velious anyway?

[heartbrand]

Originally Posted by Droog007 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I saw a post once where Rogean was musing about how to add PoP-era content without adding PoK...

discuss.

I saw that and then I saw a Nilbog post not too long ago that said custom content would never be implemented on these servers and that if it was to be added in, it would be on a completely new box.

[Gadwen]

Originally Posted by TarukShmaruk [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

EQ was top dog and MMOs were gaining popularity. It's inaccurate to claim that luclin/pop-era popularity was because of luclin changes.

That said, I loved everything about PoP except the books.

And whoever said they wanted books to funnel people into new content - that's a ridiculous claim - PoP was for high levels only. There was no new content to be had for anyone under level 40.




People twink because it's fun and it's within the game mechanics. People enjoy being able to game the system - that doesn't mean the population wants to be able to walk up to an NPC and hail them for +50 levels. There are servers like that and do you know what their population is?

The point of all this discussion is that the there has to be a balance around the innate hedonism of gamers for the good of the game. Just because I want the ability to rez myself (or not lose XP), to fly everywhere, and to reduce all downtime doesn't mean it's good for the game.

Yes you are right that MMOs had been gaining popularity, but Luclin had been out for almost 2 years, PoP almost a full year when EQ hit its peak of subs, by that point in time it was a very different game than classic for quite a while. It would a inaccurate to claim that it had nothing to do with it and was just the effects of the genre getting more popular.

And I'm not sure where having easier travel or levels going a bit faster translates into instant level 50 with one hail. But players do everything they can to make the game easier for themselves, devs have watched this behavior for years and are catering to it. I agree, there is a good point of balance, but like I said before..a games value is not based on each individual players experiences. It's how many subs they get, how many micro transactions they perform and...most MMO players want easy games.

[Halius]

Originally Posted by Droog007 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I saw a post once where Rogean was musing about how to add PoP-era content without adding PoK...

discuss.

This could be good once the Velious content becomes stale a long way down the road. I enjoyed most of the planes groups I had when I played during the PoP era, it actually wasn't too bad (I was never a fan of Luclin though). To add the PoP zones or in other words more planes to the game I would say one of two things could happen.

1. You could make PoK, just make it accessible only through druid/wizard porting and then that zone connects to all the planes. I know that would take a huge revamp of the PoK zone but it would make it so that the zone only connects you to the new planes and not to every zone, and would also make it so that the druids/wizards porting ability is still needed.

2. You could avoid PoK completely and tie the zone-ins to the new planes to existing zones, possibly even have to clear through an old plane such as PoH to get to PoD or something like that. Again it would require some tweaking, and possible nerfing to make it doable for level 60 chars (unless the up the cap to 65), but they wouldn't have to re-do any of the actual content in the PoP zones, just the levels of the mobs.

Anyways those are my thoughts.

[TarukShmaruk]

Originally Posted by Gadwen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

And I'm not sure where having easier travel or levels going a bit faster translates into instant level 50 with one hail. But players do everything they can to make the game easier for themselves, devs have watched this behavior for years and are catering to it.

Again I don't think you see the flaw in your thinking.

Devs could cater to what players do by making everything have less hp, hit for less damage, players gain twice as much XP, etc. etc. etc.

We are discussing things that are detrimental to the game as a whole despite being popular features. Again I point to the damage LFD/LFR has done to WoW server communities, the damage flying mounts did to travel in WoW, the PoK stones to travel (and the Nexus) to the EQ world, the damage PC did to the rest of the zones in the game 1-20, etc

[heartbrand]

Originally Posted by TarukShmaruk [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Again I don't think you see the flaw in your thinking.

Devs could cater to what players do by making everything have less hp, hit for less damage, players gain twice as much XP, etc. etc. etc.

We are discussing things that are detrimental to the game as a whole despite being popular features. Again I point to the damage LFD/LFR has done to WoW server communities, the damage flying mounts did to travel in WoW, the PoK stones to travel (and the Nexus) to the EQ world, the damage PC did to the rest of the zones in the game 1-20, etc

What is this massive damage books did? The entire point was to filter everyone into the new content. I really don't get it. Were you hanging out in Lower Guk during PoP killing the same frogloks you were in 1999? LDoN gave me instant groups instead of waiting around for 3 hours on a list somewhere to maybe possibly get the chance @ some exp. It gave me the shot @ getting loot via the point system so I always felt like I was progressing, but did it in a way that required that very large amount of time that EQ is famous for. It gave me hard modes to challenge me, etc. I don't get it, some people think sitting in Guk killing 5 mobs an hour was the pinnacle of EverQuest or something.

[TarukShmaruk]

Originally Posted by heartbrand [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

What is this massive damage books did? The entire point was to filter everyone into the new content. I really don't get it. Were you hanging out in Lower Guk during PoP killing the same frogloks you were in 1999? LDoN gave me instant groups instead of waiting around for 3 hours on a list somewhere to maybe possibly get the chance @ some exp. It gave me the shot @ getting loot via the point system so I always felt like I was progressing, but did it in a way that required that very large amount of time that EQ is famous for. It gave me hard modes to challenge me, etc. I don't get it, some people think sitting in Guk killing 5 mobs an hour was the pinnacle of EverQuest or something.

Huh? How did the books funnel people into new content? PoP was 46+.

What it did was enable every race/class to bind in PoK and have near instant access to any part of the world.

Yeah, it was nice for my alts, but it also killed part of the 'soul' of the game. If you don't see how negating travel and druid/wizard ports completely did that, then there's no point in this conversation.

I don't know why I have to keep repeating myself here - these are features we all used, the point is being able to acknowledge the detrimental impacts on the game they had.

[fadetree]

Originally Posted by heartbrand [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

What is this massive damage books did? The entire point was to filter everyone into the new content. I really don't get it. Were you hanging out in Lower Guk during PoP killing the same frogloks you were in 1999? LDoN gave me instant groups instead of waiting around for 3 hours on a list somewhere to maybe possibly get the chance @ some exp. It gave me the shot @ getting loot via the point system so I always felt like I was progressing, but did it in a way that required that very large amount of time that EQ is famous for. It gave me hard modes to challenge me, etc. I don't get it, some people think sitting in Guk killing 5 mobs an hour was the pinnacle of EverQuest or something.

You're conflating the ability to have new content with traveling via the PoK books. They could have had the new content without the PoK books. The PoK books were put in because people were whining about travel time. Again, consistently giving the players what they whine for will eventually ruin the game. The heart of the game, any game, is created by the difficulties.

[heartbrand]

I was 60 when PoP came out and hadn't set foot in the old world in ages tbh so it had absolutely zero impact on me. I guess if you started playing EQ then I could see your point.

[Thulack]

Originally Posted by Samoht [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

tradeskills didn't matter any more in POP than they did in luclin, and probably less than velius in either expansion

PoTC quest in Luclin made tradeskills relevant. ALOT of PoP tradeskilled items were wanted especially PoP bows. and there are tradeskilled items in Velious other then shawl that make them worth it. Not sure what your post point was but tradeskills are very relevant all through EQ.

[heartbrand]

ITT, much like every EQ Nostalgia thread on rerolled, is people equating timesinks with difficulty. Timesinks aren't difficult. Did you love VT because it had all dem trash mobs you had to spend hours and hours clearing, sure was "difficult" amirite? No, it was fucking awful. I'd much rather spend hours banging my head against the wall on a difficult raid mob as I try to figure out the encounter than do so against trivial trash mobs just to get to the raid mob. I guess it's a matter of preference. I like to play games to actually get to play. Travel was always trivial to me in classic, but I was a caster who could bind, apart from the sporadic trip to town to sell all my l33t gearz, I was always in a dungeon or what not, it's not like I was taking 3 hour strolls through the karanas erryday