WTS Plane of Hate : Loot Rights List

[BallzDeep]

Oh okay, that makes all the difference then. I guess an all encompassing rule doesn't make sense and the standard is being a cry baby is okay when you have a raid group.

The 3 people is subjective because for up and coming guilds who aren't raid geared or with proper knowledge, it will take a few more.

[Maner]

Originally Posted by BallzDeep [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Oh okay, that makes all the difference then. I guess an all encompassing rule doesn't make sense and the standard is being a cry baby is okay when you have a raid group.

The 3 people is subjective because for up and coming guilds who aren't raid geared or with proper knowledge, it will take a few more.

No it really doesn't, gear doesn't matter when you're just slowing and having a charmed mob tank and dps for you. Your monk should just be focusing on pulling the phs. In all honesty hate is probably easier with 3-5 people. You don't have an extra 20 people walking around aground stuff on the 2nd floor, or people below 50 with larger agro ranges.

[BallzDeep]

I know how the mechanics work but some guilds go up there as a raid for multiple things, especially if you are a newer guild and still needing epics. You just explained to me how it should be done if you are trying to 3 man it and sell for an MQ. I'm not in the starter guilds, I used to play IB/Ramp before I realized playing this game hardcore is dumb as shit.

[Maner]

Originally Posted by BallzDeep [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I know how the mechanics work but some guilds go up there as a raid for multiple things, especially if you are a newer guild and still needing epics. You just explained to me how it should be done if you are trying to 3 man it and sell for an MQ. I'm not in the starter guilds, I used to play IB/Ramp before I realized playing this game hardcore is dumb as shit.

I just don't understand the entitlement, is it because you have 20-30 people going to hate to do what 3 people can do that you deserve special accommodations? I can't think of a single thing in hate that you need 30 people to kill that would make future hate raids require less people. Maybe inny, but I have a theory that you can even kill inny with 5 due to how his ae mechanics work.

[BallzDeep]

You obviously have it backwards. Entitlement comes from less people > more people and greed>need. Expansions and this game was built to be progressive. You are supposed to progressively move from Classic->Kunark->Velious and go back for gear and epics as needed. The people who are entitled are always the people that want to have the most platinum or the best gear in a never-ending game. Some people raid hate to LEARN how to raid and get their first experience of raid mechanics. I know that is a hard concept to understand but that is how everquest was built. Naggy/Vox/Hate/Fear are an introduction to raiding. VS/Trak/Kunark mobs including VP are a step up from there. Velious and FTE races are the never ending end game for raid guilds. That is why it is important for some guilds to bring 30.

[Maner]

Originally Posted by BallzDeep [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You obviously have it backwards. Entitlement comes from less people > more people and greed>need. Expansions and this game was built to be progressive. You are supposed to progressively move from Classic->Kunark->Velious and go back for gear and epics as needed. The people who are entitled are always the people that want to have the most platinum or the best gear in a never-ending game. Some people raid hate to LEARN how to raid and get their first experience of raid mechanics. I know that is a hard concept to understand but that is how everquest was built. Naggy/Vox/Hate/Fear are an introduction to raiding. VS/Trak/Kunark mobs including VP are a step up from there. Velious and FTE races are the never ending end game for raid guilds. That is why it is important for some guilds to bring 30.

Oh I understand that, however nothing in hate aside from inny is a stepping stone for even VS. what skills are you learning to compete in velious FTE racing or trakonon socks? Let alone how does killing magi with 30 people prepare you for nexona or hoshkar? Claiming this is a problem because 30 people aren't cant beat 3 people at pulling a mob is pretty irrelevant

[Lobus]

Originally Posted by BallzDeep [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You obviously have it backwards. Entitlement comes from less people > more people and greed>need. Expansions and this game was built to be progressive. You are supposed to progressively move from Classic->Kunark->Velious and go back for gear and epics as needed. The people who are entitled are always the people that want to have the most platinum or the best gear in a never-ending game. Some people raid hate to LEARN how to raid and get their first experience of raid mechanics. I know that is a hard concept to understand but that is how everquest was built. Naggy/Vox/Hate/Fear are an introduction to raiding. VS/Trak/Kunark mobs including VP are a step up from there. Velious and FTE races are the never ending end game for raid guilds. That is why it is important for some guilds to bring 30.

This is probably the best reason the farming behavior is so detrimental to the community as a whole... The farmers say "Learn to raid newb", but then monopolize all the raid targets so newer player/guilds can't learn...

Even the farmers have to admit how others can see this behavior as a bunch of people who have a very real profit motive to prevent others from becoming geared & skilled enough to attain things on their own, thus forcing them to buy said things from the farmers.

Now whether the payment is just plat for plat's sake or RMT is an entirely different story but why someone would need to continue to hoard hundreds of thousands of plat. Any items they would want to buy they obviously have the time & skills to camp on their own so that can't really be reason. What I can tell is that there are a healthy number of people out there still offering RMT of various kinds in various places so there MUST be people active on p99 today who are farming for plat and items to that end.

I have no idea if this particular farming team are also RMT'ers but there MUST be farming teams who are (based on the millions of plat and hundreds of items and accounts currently up for sale). As such if all high end farming has to suffer additional scrutiny to flush out RMT'ers then that is best for the community as a whole. The alternative is to continue to allow this kind of behavior across the board and as such institutionalize the RMT trade.

That, in my opinion, is a bad outcome and i believe the owners/admins of this server agree with me due to the time they've spent trying to root out these kind of schemes.

[Raev]

Basically it all comes down to the lack of content progression. On live, 1.5 years after Velious we had Luclin. A/A would be COH battling over Vex Thal and NTOV would be relatively open/rotated, just like VP is now.

[Veridical]

So what you're saying, Raev, is Luclin confirmed? I'm gonna farm the Heck outta shield of bane warding.

[Maner]

Originally Posted by Lobus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This is probably the best reason the farming behavior is so detrimental to the community as a whole... The farmers say "Learn to raid newb", but then monopolize all the raid targets so newer player/guilds can't learn...

Even the farmers have to admit how others can see this behavior as a bunch of people who have a very real profit motive to prevent others from becoming geared & skilled enough to attain things on their own, thus forcing them to buy said things from the farmers.

Now whether the payment is just plat for plat's sake or RMT is an entirely different story but why someone would need to continue to hoard hundreds of thousands of plat. Any items they would want to buy they obviously have the time & skills to camp on their own so that can't really be reason. What I can tell is that there are a healthy number of people out there still offering RMT of various kinds in various places so there MUST be people active on p99 today who are farming for plat and items to that end.

I have no idea if this particular farming team are also RMT'ers but there MUST be farming teams who are (based on the millions of plat and hundreds of items and accounts currently up for sale). As such if all high end farming has to suffer additional scrutiny to flush out RMT'ers then that is best for the community as a whole. The alternative is to continue to allow this kind of behavior across the board and as such institutionalize the RMT trade.

That, in my opinion, is a bad outcome and i believe the owners/admins of this server agree with me due to the time they've spent trying to root out these kind of schemes.

Except the RMT accusations are coming from the angry "beginners" who are upset that their 30 beginner raiders can't kill the hate minis which are NOT raid mobs... there is no evidence that anyone involved is RMTing, it's just more deflection from people training themselves in hate. The server admins are against RMT on this server, if there was any proof that the people in question were RMTing it would be dealt with.

This whole argument that these people are somehow not letting others learn to raid is a joke. You can learn much more valuable raiding lessons doing HoT or attempting derakor than you can clearing hate trash. Honestly this entire issue is because someone in clue or fires of heaven wants something but doesn't want any competition in getting it.