2020 Election MEGAthread

[Patriam1066]

Originally Posted by Raev [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If you just stop and think for a second, the logical part of your brain will tell you that OF COURSE sociopaths will dominate any organization, because they are focused on obtaining power by standing at the top and are willing to do whatever it takes to do so, while normal people are vaguely concerned about the theoretical purpose of said organization. As the sociopaths/SJWs/pedophiles/satanists/etc gradually infiltrate, they promote each other so that together they can exploit the peasants at the bottom more freely until they reach critical mass, when the organization can no longer fulfill its nominal purpose and collapses.

The only question is whether the logical part of your brain can thus overpower the emotional part, which definitely does not want this to be true.



Of course it doesn't. All of these global organizations are fundamentally Orwellian: their purpose is the exact opposite of their name. Actual facts make it clear that masks are ridiculous. Actual facts make it clear that COVID is just the flu. So why are these organizations screaming panic at the top of their lungs? Because our elites have been busy shitting up Western Civilization by printing huge amounts of money and giving it to themselves and importing low IQ/low skill immigrants, and they need something to blame the impending collapse of the economy on that doesn't involve the peasants grabbing their pitchforks.



Serious question for you, Castle. I think you are good person who would like to Make America Great Again. What would be necessary for this to actually happen, in a moderate level of detail? I think once you begin to write this out your viewpoint may change.

We’re in the late republic phase (Rome’s institutions failing post 133 BC). That doesn’t mean conspiratorial thinking will help. Anti-monopoly legislation and gradually increasing interest rates back to 3-5% would undo most of the economic problems we face. House prices are higher even as interest rates are low. Why? Because banks offer no returns, so the wealthy only put money into real estate and stocks. And the poor don’t see a means to find returns large enough to save for a home

This could easily be undone, but crying “the Jews” or “the globalist” doesn’t turn back the clock. It just alienates sane people who could otherwise be amenable to fixing them excesses of our system. We also need deep reform to our institutions. Open primaries, elections with rank choice voting, etc

Basically, allowing more opinions into the system than just republicans and democrats, who are both bought and paid for

[Raev]

Originally Posted by FatherSioux [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Get your mask facts here folks!

Yes! Patriam and Castle are saying some useful things as well. I feel like we are finally getting a few decent posts here in this thread now!

Originally Posted by Patriam1066 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

We’re in the late republic phase (Rome’s institutions failing post 133 BC). That doesn’t mean conspiratorial thinking will help.

Just to be clear, I think there is absolutely nothing wrong with the world as it is right now. It is serving its intended purpose perfectly.

Originally Posted by Patriam1066 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

gradually increasing interest rates back to 3-5% would undo most of the economic problems we face.

Your points regarding the financial bubble are well taken. But the US national debt is currently $27 trillion. 4% interest would require about $1 trillion in interest per year. Historically it has been impossible for countries to pay off over 100% debt/GDP in real terms. So we have to choose between a deflationary collapse (massive defaults) or inflationary collapse (Venezuela/Weimar Germany style wheelbarrows of printed cash).

Originally Posted by Patriam1066 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

elections with rank choice voting, etc. Basically, allowing more opinions into the system than just republicans and democrats, who are both bought and paid for

Yes, I agree 100%, but how do you plan to accomplish this within a political system that is obviously designed NOT to work? The fact of the matter is that a substantial fraction of Americans prefer the status quo. You have the welfare leeches on the bottom, the people who like the moral superiority of lecturing their betters, and of course the psychopaths at the top who have no intention of letting go of their power.

Like I told Castle, the devil is in the details.

[Danth]

Originally Posted by Raev [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Your points regarding the financial bubble are well taken. But the US national debt is currently $27 trillion. 4% interest would require about $1 trillion in interest per year. Historically it has been impossible for countries to pay off over 100% debt/GDP in real terms. So we have to choose between a deflationary collapse (massive defaults) or inflationary collapse (Venezuela/Weimar Germany style wheelbarrows of printed cash).

Penn Central 2.0, but on an international scale. As in that case, if we go, we'll drag a lot of other leveraged nations down with us. That reality is helping prop things up longer than might otherwise be the case (if we were Venezuela, we'd have collapsed already). The complete lack of even the pretense of financial responsibility in the federal government over the past twenty years should disgust everyone. Instead it barely receives mention in media since it's no longer a political talking point--both parties are guilty and turn a blind eye. I'd say it's our own fault, but it really isn't. Nobody asked FDR to take the dollar off the gold standard. Nobody asked Nixon to let it free float. The government took that power on its own, people's opinion be damned, and neither party was interested in fixing it because they all have their hands in the pot. It's too late now, we're past the point of recovery, now it's only a question of when the bottom gives out (played skillfully, they might kick that can down the road for many years) and how bad it'll be when it happens.

As I age I gradually accept that governments are much like the ecology of western North America: Either of them have to burn once in awhile to get rid of the rotten rubbish undergrowth and renew themselves.

Danth

[Patriam1066]

Originally Posted by Raev [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yes! Patriam and Castle are saying some useful things as well. I feel like we are finally getting a few decent posts here in this thread now!



Just to be clear, I think there is absolutely nothing wrong with the world as it is right now. It is serving its intended purpose perfectly.



Your points regarding the financial bubble are well taken. But the US national debt is currently $27 trillion. 4% interest would require about $1 trillion in interest per year. Historically it has been impossible for countries to pay off over 100% debt/GDP in real terms. So we have to choose between a deflationary collapse (massive defaults) or inflationary collapse (Venezuela/Weimar Germany style wheelbarrows of printed cash).



Yes, I agree 100%, but how do you plan to accomplish this within a political system that is obviously designed NOT to work? The fact of the matter is that a substantial fraction of Americans prefer the status quo. You have the welfare leeches on the bottom, the people who like the moral superiority of lecturing their betters, and of course the psychopaths at the top who have no intention of letting go of their power.

Like I told Castle, the devil is in the details.

Well, destroying the institutions beyond repair, like not accepting election results, is absolutely the worst idea. What comes next would likely be worse

Reform is an uphill battle, notably because our population can’t seem to avoid bad food, drugs, and bad decision making. I’m not sure where we go from here, but bottom line, there will have to be much more serious consequences for corruption. Marginally higher taxes on certainly the wealthiest 1%, but probably the top 10%. Massive cuts to programs like disability, which is extremely abused, look at how many more people remarkably became disabled during the pandemic. It’s bull shit. The military budget has to be halved, public pensions disbursed only after an additional 10 years of service (a military career is 30 years instead of 20). In short, belt tightening across the board. Personally, I would cut all forms of welfare and replace them with a UBI. It’s more egalitarian and if you fuck up, boohoo

Frankly, we’re heading that way anyway. Housing prices have gone from 3-5 times the annual salary to 5-10x, depending where you live. People think that welfare benefits them, but the policies, like deficit spending, that enable this actually don’t benefit those at the bottom of the economic pyramid. This has been true for a while. I bought a house in Utah a while ago for a vacation home because there was literally nothing else to do wirh my money, in addition to putting it in trusts for grandchildren. If I were a real ass hole, I could buy 4-5 homes and rent them around the Houston area, which is exactly the result of our historically low interest rates. IF the american dream is predicated on owning a home (I’m not sure I buy that premise), the welfare state and low interest rates are antithetical to the interest of the working poor

As for political reform, that’s going to take a popular person who doesn’t get Gracchi’d. But the Republican and democratic parties are trash right now

[kjs86z]

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[Castle2.0]

Originally Posted by BlackBellamysMatter

October 13th, date the NY Post story comes out - Biden up 7.

One week later, October 20th, Biden lead cut to nearly half at 3.8.

October 13 -- Look at the polls, trust the experts.
October 20 -- We have new polls and new experts. Ignore the old polls and old experts.

The experts to be trusted are the experts WE deem experts. Therefore, WE are the super experts. Trust me, I'm an expert.

Originally Posted by Raev

What would be necessary for this to actually happen, in a moderate level of detail?

So many permutations of what could happen. SCOTUS is going right. One or two more nominees from 2020-2024 and it's STACKED. With SCOTUS, executive branch on the right, Senate holds and if house goes right as well... who knows what could happen.

Political violence against conservatives and rioting / unrest will be one of the biggest immediate challenges when Trump wins. The right will probably use it as an opportunity to put into place some strong anti-rioting laws / enforcement.

That would be a good move, but any legislation should simultaneously strengthen protections of free speech and the right to peacefully protest. We need both.

Power play impeachments without a real crime will be totally impotent weapons. The left used it as a political weapon to hurt Trump's reelection chances. Once that is gone such illegitimate impeachments have no power. Trump can simply ignore any such future impeachments and focus on his agenda.

Domestically, economy / COVID, big tech, platinum plan, nuclear energy, Antifa and China will be on the agenda. This is exactly what Trump should do.

• Open up economy, get it roaring again so people are happy and feel they have purpose
• Shut down big tech censorship (use Section 230 ruling and/or anti-monopoly law)
• Spend significant time/money helping black America. This demographic is slowly shifting more right. (Blexit / Candace Owens, and others are helping this movement.) It's the right thing to do and it will help with future elections.
• Improve our energy situation - the Green Nuclear Energy Deal
• Squash the violent left that wants to violently oppose democracy in action
• Lastly, going beyond domestic affairs, take on China. Mainly because they are a threat. But it also keeps our focus off the venom in the media / social media

[Raev]

Originally Posted by Castle2.0 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Domestically, economy / COVID, big tech, platinum plan, nuclear energy, Antifa and China will be on the agenda. This is exactly what Trump should do.

• Open up economy, get it roaring again so people are happy and feel they have purpose
• Shut down big tech censorship (use Section 230 ruling and/or anti-monopoly law)
• Spend significant time/money helping black America. This demographic is slowly shifting more right. (Blexit / Candace Owens, and others are helping this movement.) It's the right thing to do and it will help with future elections.
• Improve our energy situation - the Green Nuclear Energy Deal
• Squash the violent left that wants to violently oppose democracy in action
• Lastly, going beyond domestic affairs, take on China. Mainly because they are a threat. But it also keeps our focus off the venom in the media / social media

I agree with all of these ideas in principle. But the devil is in the details:

• What does it mean to get the economy 'roaring' again? If we have massive wealth inequality, is it roaring for everyone? How many people actually find meaning and purpose in their corporate drone jobs?
• How do we help Black America? If the massive transfer of wealth in their direction over the past 50 years has not worked, why should more work now? Why do we care more about Black America than Poor White America, or Latino America? What about Mulatto America?
• How do you improve our green energy situation? We don't have enough lithium or cobalt to run everything on batteries, even if we had nuclear plants to power them. If we decide to burn less energy, who has to reduce their consumption the most?
• How does one 'squash' the violent left? Do you censor them, or jail them? What about people like Elrood and Pretzelle who are inciting violence online?
• How do we 'take on' China? I assume you do not mean nuclear war. Do we stop trading with them altogether? Do we expel Chinese foreign nationals? Both of these involve definite winners and losers within America.

In contrast, your idea to shut down Big Tech is much more concrete, and I definitely think we should do both.

[Nuggie]

Originally Posted by kjs86z [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Hell of a beer bell there.

[Patriam1066]

Those are white people. Y’alls godlessness led us to this.

[Castle2.0]

• Biggest thing is open the freaking economy. We had record low unemployment and record high stock market. This included record low unemployment for black Americans
• Tossing money doesn't work. It doesn't work for schools or low income communities. People need social support systems in place. I worked with inner city kids for years in a mentorship program. The social component of success is huge. Seeing other people being successful that you know and modeling what they do. Seeing others from your situation go on to become successful and having faith the process works. No idea if the platinum plan will achieve this. If it's just more money, it won't work. Also, my focus isn't on "EQUALITY OF ALL" my focus is on "BETTER FOR ALL." I don't care if Bezos has 2 trillion or 20 trillion. I care if people at all levels are improving. Capitalism when it's well executed does this.
• Develop more nuclear plants.
• Crack down on riots. Arrest rioters. Antifa already labeled terrorist organization - start arresting leaders/organizations and charging them. Investigate where funding is coming from. Don't censor people. If people make clear calls for physical violence, charge em.
• Taking on China has happened to some degree. CCP is has 90M members. You cannot be a member and become a US citizen. No longer can CPP members send their kids to US for citizenship while the kid is still a professing member. This is a start. I lived in China 10+ years, too much to unpack here. The whole dialogue on China has shifted globally. EU refused to lead, the US is now leading. Expect some big changes in the future. Definitely some big risks as well.