Class R

[kotton05]

True that^

[Ravager]

I'd rather the clusterfuck be on the boards than in the game like it was before.

[Sirken]

VP (in regards to Class R and Class C) were discussed last night, enjoy - http://youtu.be/HUGQszYyf6o

[kotton05]

Originally Posted by Sirken [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

VP (in regards to Class R and Class C) were discussed last night, enjoy - http://youtu.be/HUGQszYyf6o

Enjoyed listening!

[Juryiel]

Interesting perceptions:

1. Class R rotation takes too long to allow new guilds who are not at the top of class R to gear enough and go to class C. Without the guilds who are at the top of class R moving to class C, the rotation is too long and you don't get enough shots to gear up.

2. New guilds also can't start at class C because without the necessary players / gear they will always lose out to TMO/IB so the theoretically larger number of targets would not play out in practice.

So new guilds with class C mentality will either be slowed down by the class R rotation if they go for class R mobs, or by already established class C guilds if they go for class C mobs. I think the sim repop argument for going to class C is compelling once you have a large established player base that is on at all hours, but random unexpected spawns for smaller guilds are not easy to get even in the 2 hours TMO/IB spend in VP. Rotation helps in that you know when you're up, and you know approximately when the mob will spawn, whereas with a sim repop and a small guild, they may just have no one on and get nothing.

If class C guilds mainly cared about PVP race competition much more so than amassing loot, then an acceptable solution would be to distribute mobs between class R and class C in a way proportional to the number guilds that are in these classes. This would speed up new guilds aiming to get to class C in gearing up, and when they do transition to class C, class C would get more mobs since the number of class R guilds goes down and the number of class C guilds goes up. Of course, there's a big IF at the beginning of this solution. But the rotation only takes so long because it's only 1 of every 3 spawns that goes to the rotation, and that rotation contains the vast majority of server guilds so of course gearing up with the current distribution of mobs will be slow. The distribution could be adaptive, and then guilds' real motives would be revealed.

Another solution would be to force-move class R guilds to class C after some criteria have been met (number of active players, etc), such that they can succeed well-enough against established guilds especially during sim repops. Have some requirement to be in class R basically (but anyone who wants could be in class C). Probably dangerous for server population if those guilds are really opposed to the PVP race thing though, unless the criterion is set appropriately.

Interesting, I wonder if anything will come of these considerations and discussions going on fairly widely across the server.

[Lazie]

Originally Posted by Juryiel [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Interesting perceptions:

1. Class R rotation takes too long to allow new guilds who are not at the top of class R to gear enough and go to class C. Without the guilds who are at the top of class R moving to class C, the rotation is too long and you don't get enough shots to gear up.

2. New guilds also can't start at class C because without the necessary players / gear they will always lose out to TMO/IB so the theoretically larger number of targets would not play out in practice.

So new guilds with class C mentality will either be slowed down by the class R rotation if they go for class R mobs, or by already established class C guilds if they go for class C mobs. I think the sim repop argument for going to class C is compelling once you have a large established player base that is on at all hours, but random unexpected spawns for smaller guilds are not easy to get even in the 2 hours TMO/IB spend in VP. Rotation helps in that you know when you're up, and you know approximately when the mob will spawn, whereas with a sim repop and a small guild, they may just have no one on and get nothing.

If class C guilds mainly cared about PVP race competition much more so than amassing loot, then an acceptable solution would be to distribute mobs between class R and class C in a way proportional to the number guilds that are in these classes. This would speed up new guilds aiming to get to class C in gearing up, and when they do transition to class C, class C would get more mobs since the number of class R guilds goes down and the number of class C guilds goes up. Of course, there's a big IF at the beginning of this solution. But the rotation only takes so long because it's only 1 of every 3 spawns that goes to the rotation, and that rotation contains the vast majority of server guilds so of course gearing up with the current distribution of mobs will be slow. The distribution could be adaptive, and then guilds' real motives would be revealed.

Another solution would be to force-move class R guilds to class C after some criteria have been met (number of active players, etc), such that they can succeed well-enough against established guilds especially during sim repops. Have some requirement to be in class R basically (but anyone who wants could be in class C). Probably dangerous for server population if those guilds are really opposed to the PVP race thing though, unless the criterion is set appropriately.

Interesting, I wonder if anything will come of these considerations and discussions going on fairly widely across the server.

It wouldn't be as hard as he made it out. If you wanted to go Class C right now and get keyed up for VP it's pretty easy if you are smart and somewhat patient. Trakanon is hard to go after on Sim repops when you go after VP first due to competition and with VS being the Top priority outside of VP.

All a guild would have to do is be ready to kill FFA/Class C Trakanons on repops till they get 20 to 25 teeth. He drops 2 to 5 a kill so technically you could have 20 keys in 4 kills if you are lucky but I'd say he drops 3 on average so kill 8 Trakanons. Boom. VP capable for most the dragons in there as long as you have the proper resist gear and key the right people. Kinda surprised more guilds don't do that honestly.

The bonus to also killing those Trakanons of course is the Class specific BPs and other drops he has to gear your guild. SO even when you get those 20 to 25 keys. Keep Trakanon as the priority on repops. Technically you would never have to kill an actual competitive Trakanon to advance to VP.

[Juryiel]

Originally Posted by Lazie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It wouldn't be as hard as he made it out. If you wanted to go Class C right now and get keyed up for VP it's pretty easy if you are smart and somewhat patient. Trakanon is hard to go after on Sim repops when you go after VP first due to competition and with VS being the Top priority outside of VP.

All a guild would have to do is be ready to kill FFA/Class C Trakanons on repops till they get 20 to 25 teeth. He drops 2 to 5 a kill so technically you could have 20 keys in 4 kills if you are lucky but I'd say he drops 3 on average so kill 8 Trakanons. Boom. VP capable for most the dragons in there as long as you have the proper resist gear and key the right people. Kinda surprised more guilds don't do that honestly.

The bonus to also killing those Trakanons of course is the Class specific BPs and other drops he has to gear your guild. SO even when you get those 20 to 25 keys. Keep Trakanon as the priority on repops. Technically you would never have to kill an actual competitive Trakanon to advance to VP.

I absolutely agree that it is easy for larger class R guilds to go class C. I guess I don't see how killing unexpected trakanon sim repop would be easy for a smaller guild with class C ambitions. Maybe if sim-repops were known and such a guild could ahead of time have its force be ready etc, but otherwise I don't see it. And a non-sim repop trak will probably be gotten by TMO / IB. And it's not just trak, it's mobs in general. Yes, Taken and BDA can do well in class C, but my guess is Genocidal Tendencies would not have done well for quite a long time until they were leveled / geared more, even in the 2 hours it takes for you guys to do VP or other high priority targets during sim repops.

I also think the video illustrates clearly the class R class C differences. Someone said in that video "Guilds could move to class C and get 4-5 dragons a week!" as if that was some sort of perk, and my immediate thought was "Oh god, I have to kill 4-5 dragons a week if I go to class C? " Plenty happy with the amount we get now as class R even though by class C standards it's so little. Yes, I do really like raiding, especially killing mobs we haven't killed before with the guild I'm in, but farming 4-5 dragons of the same set of 15-20 a week seems way too much for me and I bet many class R.

[nyclin]

tl;dw gimme a timestamp sirken

[Fanguru]

Not sure where this number of 30 Taken being ready for VP comes from, but it is wrong.

[Nukehard]

Originally Posted by Fanguru [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Not sure where this number of 30 Taken being ready for VP comes from, but it is wrong.

If so many ready for VP why don't they go class c? [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] sound scared to me!