FE takes sky Sundays

[Lammy]

Putting trolling aside, it's obvious FE would like to attempt to take our sky rotation for 1 of 2 reasons, or both.

1) To spite TMO, which is the obvious one
2) Because Lord bob rolled in on your sky day and you didn't get it handled.

If you don't think that TMO will come back in strong numbers, you're kidding yourself. So doing petty things like thinking you can take a Sky rotation over a technicality that was out of anyone's hands but Zeelots isn't going to achieve anything "for the server" long term if those are anyone's heartfelt intentions.

The sky rotation is a courtesy, not a rule of the server. And when you are the ones seeking to break that tradition, then you're the ones causing the problems that follow.

There has been a lot of discussion among the core group of TMO and I can say there are a ton of level headed, good people in TMO that are chastised over this decision. I'm willing to bet there are a lot of them willing to respect Rogaens desire to better the server for everyone, but attempting to kick people while their down with garbage like this will not yield you the respect you're wanting.

[Ella`Ella]

Originally Posted by quido [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The last time giving up some mobs was seriously discussed, FE wasn't interested because they needed to gear their players. You would see people like me gladly willing to leave stuff up if we knew it was going to be attempted by people who haven't killed it before. Unfortunately this takes the cooperation of every other raiding guild. Eventually BDA and Taken need to stop killing what is offered so some fresh blood can try it. Hopefully FE is geared enough by now to not be so desperate.

Sometimes I wonder what smells worse; your bullshit or your breath.

You're a stone cold capitalist, much like myself. Zeelot and I bullshitted for a bit over tells the other night and as soon as I mentioned negotiations on making a change to the raid scene the communication stopped. I like Zee. I've both killed and been killed by him in VP, but from one leader to another, the other side of the fence seems and has seemed to have zero interest in amending the current situation.

[Hitpoint]

Actually Lammy we want to take your old slot because Saturday morning is the most garbage time slot in the whole rotation. We've been trying to trade with another guild for months. And a spot just opened so we want it.

Edit: This thread that we're posting in was made 15 minutes before we even knew lord Bob guild was in sky.

[Daldolma]

Originally Posted by Lammy [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Putting trolling aside, it's obvious FE would like to attempt to take our sky rotation for 1 of 2 reasons, or both.

1) To spite TMO, which is the obvious one
2) Because Lord bob rolled in on your sky day and you didn't get it handled.

If you don't think that TMO will come back in strong numbers, you're kidding yourself. So doing petty things like thinking you can take a Sky rotation over a technicality that was out of anyone's hands but Zeelots isn't going to achieve anything "for the server" long term if those are anyone's heartfelt intentions.

The sky rotation is a courtesy, not a rule of the server. And when you are the ones seeking to break that tradition, then you're the ones causing the problems that follow.

There has been a lot of discussion among the core group of TMO and I can say there are a ton of level headed, good people in TMO that are chastised over this decision. I'm willing to bet there are a lot of them willing to respect Rogaens desire to better the server for everyone, but attempting to kick people while their down with garbage like this will not yield you the respect you're wanting.

This isn't "kicking people while they're down". This is making a guild pay for their petulant antics. You could've eaten the well-deserved raid suspension and come back in two weeks, at which point -- only by the grace of Rogean -- you'd be getting back ~80 accounts that should all be permanently banned, if we're following the letter of the law.

Instead, a significant number of your members are in the process of evading the raid suspension and griefing others. Your leadership decided to disband the guild, presumably to make some sort of a statement. Okay, statement made. Now live with the consequences of that statement. No guild means no guild rotation spot for Sky. Don't like it? Shouldn't have disbanded. Shouldn't have had members disperse between a handful of other guilds.

[Ella`Ella]

Originally Posted by Lammy [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Putting trolling aside, it's obvious FE would like to attempt to take our sky rotation for 1 of 2 reasons, or both.

1) To spite TMO, which is the obvious one
2) Because Lord bob rolled in on your sky day and you didn't get it handled.

If you don't think that TMO will come back in strong numbers, you're kidding yourself. So doing petty things like thinking you can take a Sky rotation over a technicality that was out of anyone's hands but Zeelots isn't going to achieve anything "for the server" long term if those are anyone's heartfelt intentions.

The sky rotation is a courtesy, not a rule of the server. And when you are the ones seeking to break that tradition, then you're the ones causing the problems that follow.

There has been a lot of discussion among the core group of TMO and I can say there are a ton of level headed, good people in TMO that are chastised over this decision. I'm willing to bet there are a lot of them willing to respect Rogaens desire to better the server for everyone, but attempting to kick people while their down with garbage like this will not yield you the respect you're wanting.

If my guild or its leadership wanted to shit on Lord Bob's parade, we would have. And, this has nothing to do with spite, when I penned my server chat letter to TMO and the community, I had sincerity in my notion of having only goodwill towards TMO. Alarti and Eccezan are a two man clown show, but many of your members are both friends of mine personally and of our members.

[Lammy]

Originally Posted by Daldolma [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This isn't "kicking people while they're down". This is making a guild pay for their petulant antics. You could've eaten the well-deserved raid suspension and come back in two weeks, at which point -- only by the grace of Rogean -- you'd be getting back ~80 accounts that should all be permanently banned, if we're following the letter of the law.

Instead, a significant number of your members are in the process of evading the raid suspension and griefing others. Your leadership decided to disband the guild, presumably to make some sort of a statement. Okay, statement made. Now live with the consequences of that statement. No guild means no guild rotation spot for Sky. Don't like it? Shouldn't have disbanded. Shouldn't have had members disperse between a handful of other guilds.

How is this not spite?

And yes, I would agree, disbanding the guild and causing a ruckus is not a good idea and is not the general attitude of the TMO core. But unfortunately, just like the 2 dupers that triggered this whole mess, we can't control what other people do with their accounts. To say 80 accounts should be perma band is ridiculous and niave.

Do you feel that Liia is a cheater and should be permanently banned because she was collateral damage? No, she shouldn't, she's one of the nicest people on the server.

I understand that everyone in the raid scene is extremely excited, and loving that TMO was torn apart. However, as a whole it's still a very motivated group of players that are currently sitting by and taking our punishment while we decide what the next course of action is.

[YendorLootmonkey]

Originally Posted by Lammy [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

And yes, I would agree, disbanding the guild and causing a ruckus is not a good idea and is not the general attitude of the TMO core.

And that's the crux of the issue for the last two years or so.

The actions of a few in TMO taint the entire guild, and the rest sit idly by, turning the other cheek, and allow it to happen.

The funny thing is, if it weren't for people like Alarti, Eccezan, Knix, Tiggles, Jeremy, etc shitting up the forums rubbing everything in everyone's faces, spinning everything, twisting everything around, and generally shitting on the rest of the server, this probably wouldn't be such the huge deal that it is now.

The forum trolls never got reigned in, the forum moles/trainers/leapfroggers/cheaters tarnished TMO's reputation, and this "respectable faction of TMO" sat and did nothing. TMO cockblocked the entire server after they had more than enough time in VP uncontested, and your "good guy TMO faction" did nothing. No one was holding a gun against your head to remain in the guild. No one. You supported this through your own inaction.

And now it's happening all over again... you've got the same group of d-bags that just want to watch the server burn, rules lawyer a raid suspension with the "tee hee, TMO was raid suspended, but that guild doesn't exist anymore, so I individually can raid!" while simultaneously trying to rules lawyer a contradictory "tee hee, just because we don't have a tag doesn't mean we still don't exist, therefore our slot in the Sky rotation is still ours!" (seriously, your legal teams should really consult each other first before trying to use a loophole in divergent ways.), trying to shit up the rest of the server's efforts of a peaceful sharing/rotation/less cutthroat raid scene by saturating 4-5 guilds with like-minded TMO.

I don't expect you to do anything about it now, because you can't... but these are the people from which you looked the other way and let run rampant in your guild for the last 2ish years. NOW you don't understand why the rest of the server does not consider you separately from them?

[Yinikren]

Your next course of action? You don't have to ponder it, it was laid out before you already: You will set no rules and you will not raid for the next two weeks if you had a TMO tag on 12/19/13.

After that, you guys may do as you please, in accordance with the player-made raid rules set by the high guilds of the server interested in a better raid environment. You will find your spot in due time.

There are no negotiations to this. This server is becoming a better place for everyone who wants to raid, with or without your disbanded guild.

[Daldolma]

Originally Posted by Lammy [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

How is this not spite?

And yes, I would agree, disbanding the guild and causing a ruckus is not a good idea and is not the general attitude of the TMO core. But unfortunately, just like the 2 dupers that triggered this whole mess, we can't control what other people do with their accounts. To say 80 accounts should be perma band is ridiculous and niave.

Do you feel that Liia is a cheater and should be permanently banned because she was collateral damage? No, she shouldn't, she's one of the nicest people on the server.

I understand that everyone in the raid scene is extremely excited, and loving that TMO was torn apart. However, as a whole it's still a very motivated group of players that are currently sitting by and taking our punishment while we decide what the next course of action is.

You're missing the point entirely. Whether Liia is a cheater or not is immaterial. She trusted the wrong person. Once an account is logged in by a known exploiter, the account is contaminated. The GMs couldn't and shouldn't investigate the mental state of every account owner to see if they were complicit. That is the risk of giving out your info. Liia took that risk. She should pay the price as defined by server rules.

[Raavak]

Originally Posted by radditsu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I find it hard to believe that they can raid in a raiding zone while being raid suspended. ..

FE/IB raided Sky, Hate, and Fear while under a raid suspension. Guess it really means competitive raid suspension.

I find it amazing that FE wants to shit all over the established rotation all of a sudden, but not surprising.