So what's there to do in Velious anyway?

[heartbrand]

I don't get what some people wanted from EQ. There were books so that they could filter you into the new content. Did people want the game to just remain the classic zones with a zone addition here and there connected to the old world?

[Dirtnap]

Originally Posted by heartbrand [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't get what some people wanted from EQ. There were books so that they could filter you into the new content. Did people want the game to just remain the classic zones with a zone addition here and there connected to the old world?

The lore on Live is pretty cool if you actually learn the vast amount of it that there is now. There were a lot of symbols and the like in classic that were never explained, but could be found in many locations across the world. They have explained an immense amount of the mysteries of classic EQ with pretty interesting lore.

Sure it kind of split off to be a bit more sci-fi than fantasy, but I feel like all fantasy must eventually become sci-fi. Its not like technology just stops progressing, even in magical settings.

EDIT: Gnomes will forever keep tinkering new inventions, so Norrath would eventually have television, radio, the internet, youtube, and various other modern tech. Go figure, Gnomes already has us beat with robots.

[xCry0x]

Everyone is bitching about the book room when the firepots in TD are more or less the same mechanic.

It is actually funny to think that Sony added it, decided it was bad, nerfed it, then added it again a few years later.

[heartbrand]

Here's the thing, everyone's entitled to their own definition of fun or what not, to me, a lot of the stuff people call "fun" from classic EQ was really me sitting being unable to play the game such as: waiting on long lists for a spot in a group that was camping 3-5 mobs every 30 minutes in guk or sol b, waiting for a port for 30 + minutes, sitting in gfay for hours to try to sell a single item, etc., etc.

[Gadwen]

Originally Posted by Hobie819 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

For everyone saying it was a time sink - what isn't a time sink in classic? Leveling is a HUGE time sink but we don't advocate for that to be easier. Tradeskills? Huge time sink. Selling in EC? huge time sink. Taking ports out of the game because it was a "huge time sink" justifies you to play another game because if one thing is removed for being a time sink, every time sink should be removed.

Time sinks are meant to take a lot of time for a reward. Take the time to level tradeskills? You can make cool things. Take the time to level? you can be mower powerful and see more aspects of the game. Take the time to run or port? You can get to somewhere to explore, or level your character.

Like it or not, classic EQ revolves around everything being a time sink. It is one of the major complaints about the newer MMORPG's - everything is too easy.

You can't have it both ways - if you want the game to remain challenging, you cannot remove the time-sinks. If you want it to be trivialized, you may as well play WoW or any other number of MMORPG's on the market.

Taking the boat is a time sink. Getting a port is a means to avoid that time sink.

PLing and twinking are means of avoiding the time sink of leveling and camping gear.

Players worked their asses off trying to figure out ways to avoid time sinks and tedious aspects of gameplay, and they still do it today on this server. Look at how many people buy characters to avoid leveling them, or buy PLs to avoid the grind, or roll twinks with a fungi and Cof so they dominate everything they encounter for 45-55 levels. When it comes down to it, most people want it easy. SOE watched how players behaved and they were successful when they made the changes that made the game easier...it brought more people in.

Don't get me wrong, I love classic EQ and I would rather be here than anywhere else. The changes luclin and PoP brought to game were embraced by more people than classic EQ was, and observing the average player is where they got most of their ideas.

[heartbrand]

I dunno I loved PoP because there was just so much fucking stuff to do, tradeskills finally mattered, there was a logical progression, you felt epic each time you keyed yourself to the next tier, itemization actually finally made sense, there for the first time in an expac was a path of itemization for the non-raider [ornate armor] and the raider [elemental gear], etc., etc. You had raids that could be done with PUGs like PoD / Terris, etc., and then content that needed epic sized force, 72, to do. The music was great, the graphics were great, the lore was great, there were really good quests with good rewards, you could unlock progression through raid content or through groupable quests, etc., etc., I thought it was best expac in the history of MMORPG's to be honest other than the "ending" with Druzzil Ro.

[Samoht]

tradeskills didn't matter any more in POP than they did in luclin, and probably less than velius in either expansion

[heartbrand]

You had for the first time gear that was on par with raid quality loot that could be made

[TarukShmaruk]

Originally Posted by Gadwen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Taking the boat is a time sink. Getting a port is a means to avoid that time sink.

PLing and twinking are means of avoiding the time sink of leveling and camping gear.

Players worked their asses off trying to figure out ways to avoid time sinks and tedious aspects of gameplay, and they still do it today on this server. Look at how many people buy characters to avoid leveling them, or buy PLs to avoid the grind, or roll twinks with a fungi and Cof so they dominate everything they encounter for 45-55 levels. When it comes down to it, most people want it easy. SOE watched how players behaved and they were successful when they made the changes that made the game easier...it brought more people in.

Don't get me wrong, I love classic EQ and I would rather be here than anywhere else. The changes luclin and PoP brought to game were embraced by more people than classic EQ was, and observing the average player is where they got most of their ideas.

EQ was top dog and MMOs were gaining popularity. It's inaccurate to claim that luclin/pop-era popularity was because of luclin changes.

That said, I loved everything about PoP except the books.

And whoever said they wanted books to funnel people into new content - that's a ridiculous claim - PoP was for high levels only. There was no new content to be had for anyone under level 40.

Look at how many people buy characters to avoid leveling them, or buy PLs to avoid the grind, or roll twinks with a fungi and Cof so they dominate everything they encounter for 45-55 levels. When it comes down to it, most people want it easy. SOE watched how players behaved and they were successful when they made the changes that made the game easier...it brought more people in.

People twink because it's fun and it's within the game mechanics. People enjoy being able to game the system - that doesn't mean the population wants to be able to walk up to an NPC and hail them for +50 levels. There are servers like that and do you know what their population is?

The point of all this discussion is that the there has to be a balance around the innate hedonism of gamers for the good of the game. Just because I want the ability to rez myself (or not lose XP), to fly everywhere, and to reduce all downtime doesn't mean it's good for the game.

[Droog007]

I saw a post once where Rogean was musing about how to add PoP-era content without adding PoK...

discuss.