"Fair and legitimate chance at a target" (cont)

[Barcelona]

I personally was not around during the R/C/FFA days, and I may not understand fully how it all worked. It is my understanding that this system allowed for all of the above requests, in a fair and negotiable way (everyone gave up something).

It allowed for the:
1. competition that some crave
2. a chance for those to enjoy encounters they may not otherwise have,
3. hell, it even allowed for the poopsock 16 hour wallstaring if that was your thing.

It seems to me none of these were all of the time 24/7.

All things in moderation I suppose

It almost seems what we need is everyone to come to the table and develop this system again, as it pertains to at least SOME VELIOUS RAID MOBS, if not, all of them. I for one personally enjoy the rush of competition, with no uncontested rotations. I guess what I am wondering is this:

Was this R/C/FFA system a way to have guilds compete with each other, with whom are on the same level, give or take, of competition?

[Naethyn]

The problem with AC is that it doesn't reduce the maximum potential damage, it only reduces the number of high damage hits you take. That means no matter how much AC you stack you will always take max hits. For this reason it is far better to just have max HP for targets like AoW, Red Dragons, and Growth minis. Does that mean AC is broke? No, it just doesn't make it impossible to be max hit.

[arsenalpow]

Originally Posted by Barcelona [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I personally was not around during the R/C/FFA days, and I may not understand fully how it all worked. It is my understanding that this system allowed for all of the above requests, in a fair and negotiable way (everyone gave up something).

It allowed for the:
1. competition that some crave
2. a chance for those to enjoy encounters they may not otherwise have,
3. hell, it even allowed for the poopsock 16 hour wallstaring if that was your thing.

It seems to me none of these were all of the time 24/7.

All things in moderation I suppose

It almost seems what we need is everyone to come to the table and develop this system again, as it pertains to at least SOME VELIOUS RAID MOBS, if not, all of them. I for one personally enjoy the rush of competition, with no uncontested rotations. I guess what I am wondering is this:

Was this R/C/FFA system a way to have guilds compete with each other, with whom are on the same level, give or take, of competition?

I'll try to answer this but I'm on a phone. The system allowed for differing play styles but the end result was the class C big dogs were still getting the vast majority of the kills. Class R had a rotation for a year that eventually fell apart when the big guilds (BDA, Taken, Div) got frustrated with the way the smaller guilds would each keep a rotation slot but continue to ally for targets thus bloating the rotation. This led to class R being hardcore-lite.

The p99 raid scene is an arms race. Once a new effective tactic becomes discovered it gets adopted by everyone. Not using the best tactics means you don't get loot so everyone is forced to adapt to the highest common denominator. The class system could come back into play but there would have to be an insane amount of cooperation between all the class R guilds. Historically that never works out long term because you end up with 6-10 dividing up 33% of the content, and realistically it will be less than that because you can be sure there will be a selection of mobs that only class C gets access to (in kunark only class C guilds got access to VP)

[Ravager]

Originally Posted by Legday [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

And I'm not surprised, given your history and the fact that you still shit post on these forums, that you took my 25-40 spread and called it 40.

The point is that its not 10, since some other people have used that number to make Sirken's post look much more lopsided than it really is.

It is lopsided, since one side is bigger than the other and the 60-75% side (going by your numbers) got told to go play somewhere else. That's a pretty significant portion of the server.

[Bubbles]

The original server rules were the first group of associated people to put 15 butts on a spawn point got the mob.

That was how little the staff wanted to be involved in the raid scene in the beginning.

Fast forward 8 years, and here we are. Only difference is the raiding scene still has a self-important view of itself.

Nilbog didn't build this beast to grab popcorn and see who got Lord Nagafen each week. New flash.

[Raev]

Originally Posted by Naethyn [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The problem with AC is that it doesn't reduce the maximum potential damage

This is neat, simple, logical, and wrong. For example, suppose you are tanking the Avatar of War. A full round requires:

• Flurry check (say 0.5)
• Dual wield check x2 (say 0.8)
• Double attack check x4 (say 0.8)
• Hit check x 8 (say 0.6)
• Max hit check x 8 (say 0.55 for an HP stacking warrior, or 0.40 for an AC stacking warrior)

So the Avatar will get 8 max hits on an HP stacking warrior approximately every 50,000 attack rounds (p = 0.5 * 0.8^6 * 0.6^8 * 0.55^8) and on the AC stacking warrior every 700,000 attack rounds (p = 0.5 * 0.8^6 * 0.6^8 * 0.55^8).

TLDR: AC does in fact reduce the maximum practical damage.

[Fasttimes]

Basically all you need is 46.5 monks with whirlwind and mallets

[Naethyn]

Originally Posted by Raev [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This is neat, simple, logical, and wrong. For example, suppose you are tanking the Avatar of War. A full round requires:

• Flurry check (say 0.5)
• Dual wield check x2 (say 0.8)
• Double attack check x4 (say 0.8)
• Hit check x 8 (say 0.6)
• Max hit check x 8 (say 0.55 for an HP stacking warrior, or 0.40 for an AC stacking warrior)

So the Avatar will get 8 max hits on an HP stacking warrior approximately every 50,000 attack rounds (p = 0.5 * 0.8^6 * 0.6^8 * 0.55^8) and on the AC stacking warrior every 700,000 attack rounds (p = 0.5 * 0.8^6 * 0.6^8 * 0.55^8).

TLDR: AC does in fact reduce the maximum practical damage.

AC will defineatly reduce the total damage taken over the fight, but my point is the mobs maximum hit does not get reduced. With more AC you'll see a 1568 hit from AoW far less often, but it won't prevent it from occurring. This means a tank with more health is preferred over a tank who takes less a damage over time with a rolling ch chain.

[Skew]

Originally Posted by Fasttimes [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Basically all you need is 46.5 monks with whirlwind and mallets

[FatMice]

I would to be apart of that.