TOV - Pulling Mobs to ENT

[Alarti0001]

Originally Posted by Culkasi [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Could we get back to discussing pulling in ToV and not who is most stupid at forumquesting? The original discussion was actually very interesting and relevant

Its super interesting but 100% NOT relevant until you get a GM comment.

[Raev]

As much as I hate to agree with Alarti, when the raid leader of the only guild to actually kill anything in ToV without betabuff and GM hax and such posts a picture of Mark Wahlberg breaking his computer, it's probably not that relevant.

[Daldaen]

• ToV - Kill in Wing
• Kael - Kill in Wing
• Kland/Sontalak - Kill at spawn/near DN/ToV zone in spires
• Zlandicar - Kill in room
• Yelinak - Kill in room/surrounding ring
• Velketor/Lord Bob - Kill in room
• Dain - Kill in Well
• Wuoshi/Kelorek - Wherever (no kiting)
• Tunare - Wherever

I think thats pretty straight forward. FTE rules need some sort of revisting. Certain areas should have a different claim to "FTE" rights, similar to triggered mobs. The Efreeti's in sky being a perfect example of this working well. You kill mob X, you have 20min to engage the boss.

For Aaryonar for example, once he spawns the first guild to kill one of the drakes (first KoS ones at stairs) has a 20min timer to engage Aary. Killing Aary gives you a 20-30min timer to engage the next dragon of your choosing. Any wipe/failure to engage in 20-30min opens up all NToV merbs. I think this sort of system would work well IMO.

[Sampten]

Taken's pull/wipe of KT to the WL zone line did cause issues. It blocked the ability for people to traverse across Kael and is thus a zone disruption.

While that was going on, BDA pulled Wuoshi to the WL/Kael zone line. That too caused people to get hit with an AE and were left to choose to die by Wuoshi in WL or KT in Kael.

I don't think either of these are viable places to be pulling mobs as it directly impacted people trying to get across zones. This would fall under zone disruption and against the play nice policy. As a community we need to agree to amiable solution.

Wuoshi can be pulled just about anywhere in WL, but pulling to the Kael zone line shouldn't be allowed.

I think an easily agreed spot to pull Wuoshi to should be the South East corner (directly south as you zone out of Kael). This will not interfere with people traveling across WL to SkyShrine.

While KT was often pulled to the WL zone line on Live, I think we are going to need to agree to another spot to pull him to so that people can freely run across Kael without being killed in the event of a wipe.

[Daldaen]

Well in fairness - The 20 giant train that kept ping ponging and eventually got dropped on us by people running through caused the wipe. A train which is not classic, none of those mobs between EW and WL should see Invis but they do.

That being said. I agree that pull locations should be agreed upon. But when people don't want to actually have a real discussion in raid forums nothing can be done until GMs stop it. GMs stopped the Zlandicar exploit pull for example because mobs aren't supposed to path single through walls.

For Kael - I suggested the archways into the wings should be the maximum limit which these targets can be pulled to. On live these archways were the first see Invis mobs you would face and they represent separations of wings similar to how doors represent different wings in ToV. I think this would be a good idea of a limit if people could agree to it.

[Ele]

Originally Posted by Daldaen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Well in fairness - The 20 giant train that kept ping ponging and eventually got dropped on us by people running through caused the wipe. A train which is not classic, none of those mobs between EW and WL should see Invis but they do.

Another issue with this is people not knowing (or caring) that rooted mobs will add them to the aggro list as they run by it.

[ddxdy]

To be fair as well, once the first train in Kael started, there was pretty much a train going non-stop for the next 12 hours. A lot of that had to do with the Noble agro when people would go to do their skyshrine quest.

I was really tempted last night to FD in the Noble house, turn fraps on overnight, then make a time lapsed video to the tune of let the bodies hit the floor. Everyone who ran in, dropped invis to turn in quest items, and immediately got destroyed by Noble was hilarious. It was easily 1-2 people/min, and one of the main sources of trains all night were people who managed to make it out of the Noble house and book it to zone line.

[Sampten]

Originally Posted by Daldaen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Well in fairness - The 20 giant train that kept ping ponging and eventually got dropped on us by people running through caused the wipe. A train which is not classic, none of those mobs between EW and WL should see Invis but they do.

That being said. I agree that pull locations should be agreed upon. But when people don't want to actually have a real discussion in raid forums nothing can be done until GMs stop it. GMs stopped the Zlandicar exploit pull for example because mobs aren't supposed to path single through walls.

For Kael - I suggested the archways into the wings should be the maximum limit which these targets can be pulled to. On live these archways were the first see Invis mobs you would face and they represent separations of wings similar to how doors represent different wings in ToV. I think this would be a good idea of a limit if people could agree to it.

I think we can all agree that last night was a bit of a cluster and was to be expected. I'm very reasonable and don't take issue with it under the specific circumstances that was launch night. That being said, it's one thing to have happen last night, and another thing for this to be considered acceptable and standard procedure.

I think Tormax is going to need to be pulled to a spot somewhere on that path that isn't in argo range of the pathway between WL/EW....someplace south of the Bank. I know there's no "great" spot but it has to be far enough away to not agro people who will be going across the zone.

I know from our standpoint, Taken's KT attempts/trains of mobs/etc. caused us to have people die to Tormax (after the wipe) or to see invis giants that were not in a spot that they were supposed to be due to training off/pulling/etc. We were trying to get by and get to Skyshrine, your pulls/wipe cost us time/disrupted our force, which would go against Play Nice policy. BDA pulling Wuoshi to the WL/Kael zone line further complicated matters as it basically prevented people from running across until the mob was dead.

Again, let me reiterate, I'm not here to point fingers or play blame games. This isn't rants and flames, or a gripe session, nor am I upset at how things played out last night. The purpose here is to establish logical places to pull raid mobs so that it doesn't disrupt zones, and allows all members of the community, whether in a guild or not, the ability traverse across the zones without being squashed by a raid mob.

[Daldaen]

Yep - Kael raid mobs cannot pass the archways which lead into their area. That's simple enough and practical.

Make a rule and guilds will adapt.

[Ella`Ella]

Originally Posted by Daldaen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Make a rule and guilds will adapt.

Rules destroy the creativity this game allowed for and prohibits players from 'adapting'.