Another reason entitlements need to go bye-bye

[Asher]

Originally Posted by Daldolma [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Do you people seriously think we're in Iraq for the Iraqis?

There are many theories as to why we are in Iraq. I personally do not believe it was for WMD.

No matter what the reasoning is the money would be better spent here.

Asher

[Daldolma]

Originally Posted by Asher [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

There are many theories as to why we are in Iraq. I personally do not believe it was for WMD.

No matter what the reasoning is the money would be better spent here.

Asher

I don't believe it was for WMDs, either. Nor do I believe W is a petty child that wanted to fill in the gaps left by his father. What I believe is that Iraq and Afghanistan are in the center of the most oil-rich region in the known world, and ensuring the availability of that oil as competition grew in East Asia was of utmost importance -- important enough to fabricate a war.

And I do believe it's debatable whether or not the money would be better spent here.

[Asher]

Originally Posted by Daldolma [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't believe it was for WMDs, either. Nor do I believe W is a petty child that wanted to fill in the gaps left by his father. What I believe is that Iraq and Afghanistan are in the center of the most oil-rich region in the known world, and ensuring the availability of that oil as competition grew in East Asia was of utmost importance -- important enough to fabricate a war.

And I do believe it's debatable whether or not the money would be better spent here.

I think oil plays a much larger role than most governments are willing to admit.

Things happens all over Africa all the time and no one gives a shit but heaven forbid Libya, a large oil supplier to Europe, has problems. If they were a large supplier to the US we would probably be more involved in that war right now too.

So, assuming that is the reason we are in Iraq right now how has it benefited the average American?

We can all see how oil companies have profited. We can all see sky rocketing prices at the pump compared to pre-Iraq and before all the unstability in the oil market. We have seen a defense budget balloon at a crazy rate costing a lot of our tax dollars.

Most US oil comes from Canada. How does this war benefit us and justify the crazy ass spending we have had to do to support it and will have to continue spending to support even after the war is over.

I laugh when Fox News talks about Obama being at fault for the credit downgrade. John Boehner said he got 98% of what he wanted. The right wouldn't budge at all on tax increases for the weathly, which a majority of the nation supports despite what the right will have you believe.

That bill was not compromise at all. W. and corporate greed sunk the economy and now we are gonna fix it on the backs of the poor and middle class.

Sound fair?

Republicans like to spend just as much as the Democrats if not more I would argue. They just like to sink our dollars into the pockets of other nations and our wealthy. At least Democrats want to spend the money here to benefit people here.

I don't know how they get away with being called fiscally conservative. I wish the Tea Party didn't just wake up when Obama was elected.

Asher

[Harrison]

I don't care what color the president is, or anyone is, for that matter.

How's that racism working out for you IRL old man? Angry the civil rights movement didn't go your way when you were growing up?

[inyane]

social security is a ponzi scheme, but its ok cause its the government doing it

[Chanur]

Social Security would have a 2.4Trillion dollar surplus if it had not been robbed . Second SS will never go away, the Republicants don't want to cancel it. They want to privatize it so their banker owners can invest it with no risk and steal the interest profits. Same thing that's currently happening to widows and families of killed soldiers and their insurance pay outs.

[purist]

This morning I was awoken by my alarm clock powered by electricity generated by the public power monopoly regulated by the US Department of Energy.

I then took a shower in the clean water provided by the municipal water utility. Then, I brushed my teeth with that water, filtered to standards set by the EPA and my state.

After that, I turned on the TV to one of the FCC regulated channels to see what the National Weather Service of the National Oceanographic and Atmospheric Administration determined the weather was going to be like using satellites designed, built, and launched by the National Aeronautics and Space Administration. I watched this while eating my breakfast of US Department of Agriculture inspected food and taking the drugs which have been determined as safe by the Food and Drug Administration.

At the appropriate time as regulated by the US Congress and kept accurate by the National Institute of Standards and Technology and the US Naval Observatory, I get into my National Highway Traffic Safety Administration approved automobile and set out to work on the roads built by the local, state, and federal Departments of Transportation, possibly stopping to purchase additional fuel of a quality level determined by the Environmental Protection Agency, using legal tender issued by the Federal Reserve Bank and printed by the Federal Bureau of Engraving and Printing. On the way out the door I deposit any mail I have to be sent out via the US Postal Service and drop the kids off at the public school.

I park my car on the street, paved and maintained by the Department of Transportation, and put quarters issued by the United States Mint into the parking meter.

Then, after spending another day not being maimed or killed at work thanks to the workplace regulations imposed by the Department of Labor and the Occupational Safety and Health Administration, I drive back to my house which has not burned down in my absence because of the state and local building codes and the fire marshal's inspection, and which has not been plundered of all its valuables thanks to the local police department.

I then log onto the Internet which was developed by the Defense Advanced Research Projects Administration and post on freerepublic and fox news forums about how SOCIALISM in medicine is BAD because the government can't do anything right. Keep government out of my Medicare!

[Peatree]

Man I had no idea this thread would go so far. Who knew?

[Cyrano]

After reading this all I have learned is that Daldoma is smarter than anyone else in this thread.

You guys sit here blaming wars, or programs, or individuals, but it's pretty obvious that our greatest problem is the lack of cohesion amongst politicians and their constituents. Neither side is willing to bend and is more concerned with making their opponents look guilty than they are with actually creating a better future.

Barkingturtle you seem like an intelligent chap as well but I'm not sure what got up your ass to the point of resorting to name calling that you did. In my opinion your argument is based on pointing out what is wrong rather than offering any solution towards fixing those problems. I'm with the others here, you can't compare a our nation to Norway and you can't expect implementing their model for governance over ours would elicit similar results. Too much of our money and interest is invested outside of our own borders, including military and defense spending, to maintain the social programs they do. Socialized medicine will never work in the US simply because we're too big and not because of greed or any large scale lack of compassion.

Personally, what I think we need is for politicians to think smaller and be willing to compromise on those small issues. You can't expect to reform one of our biggest industries or programs completely and then get people to just fall in line. Healthcare reform affects too many people's lives in the business sector to expect them to shut up when they're seeing their livelihood change in the course of a few months. You act as if the insurance companies have the government in their pocket but it's one of the few industries where they are only allowed to make a certain percentage of profit per entity. Think about that, if you owned a car part store and the government said you could only make 4% profit over your total operational cost it would be infuriating. They're capping companies to keep them from making too much while forcing small business to carry insurance for every employee by 2014 or begin paying fees. That's complete crap, business owners shouldn't have to provide everything for their employees. They give them jobs, it should be up to the employees to manage their money effectively enough to pay for their own insurance. If someone is willing to offer a benefits package it should be considered a perk and not a government mandated entitlement. This is a perfect example of illogical expectations between extreme liberal doctrine and government ordinance. The worst part is that this type of program will mean less jobs overall because the owners will have to burn positions, redistribute workload, then increase benefit management spending to make heads and tails of the ever-changing laws associated with this reform.

Again for me it all comes back to a lack of accountability on all fronts. Why actually make some sacrifices when you can simple entrench yourself and point fingers as shit gets worse? If we had instead started smaller and mandated that all individuals carry health insurance by law and tested those waters for awhile we might have some actual progress. Overhauling everything will never work, but with a four year window of power partisanism will continue to reign.

[Asher]

Originally Posted by Cyrano [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Healthcare reform affects too many people's lives in the business sector to expect them to shut up when they're seeing their livelihood change in the course of a few months. You act as if the insurance companies have the government in their pocket but it's one of the few industries where they are only allowed to make a certain percentage of profit per entity. Think about that, if you owned a car part store and the government said you could only make 4% profit over your total operational cost it would be infuriating.

I realize you don't feel this way but I don't feel people should be profiting off of other peoples illnesses. Everyone needs or will need healthcare at some point in their life and everyone should have healthcare. I realize it will probably never happen in the US but healthcare should be nationalized.

Allowing people to destroy their bodies, not carry insurance and let problems fester until they are eligible for the Medicare gravy train isn't good either. Insurance should be manditory for everyone to make it work so problems can be prevented and not have the burden passed on to medicare.

The only way it shouldn't be manditory is if we as a society decide it is acceptible to let people die if they cannot afford the costs of the healthcare they need. You don't carry insurance and you get shot why the hell should I have to pay for you to get healed when you should have had it in the first place. You rolled the dice and lost.

Asher