sk starting points

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I already did. I only hope he takes my advice and repeats it on a level-relevant mob that isn’t 55 below him. My bet is the dps difference will be larger.

After we get his input then the debate can begin properly on whether that extra 20 intelligence actually makes a hill of beans difference.

(I already won’t without some serious theory-crafting with cherry picked “what if” situations where both SKs start off at 100% mana)

You didnt point out any flaws. You are missing the entire point. The test I did is the best case scenario in terms of a DPS increase.

Fighting a mob closer to my level will simply lower the DPS done, and the DPS difference. You don't understand the forumlas if you think extra mitigation will somehow increase the DPS differences in 20 STR.

If your claim is the DPS difference will be larger, you need to prove it. Like the other thread you referenced, you simply keep asking everybody else to prove your own points.

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Fighting a mob closer to my level will simply lower the DPS done, and the DPS difference.

It will lower your total dps yes. It will widen the dps gap when you are fighting something not trivial.

I’m 100% confident. I, unlike you, apparently understand how melee damage works in this game. It is a function of your attack, the mobs level, the mobs ac, your strength etc. the closer the mob is to your level, the more important relative attack (influenced directly by strength) is.

This is pretty basic NerdQuest knowledge man.

Go find a good dark blue mob and repeat.

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It will lower your total dps yes. It will widen the dps gap when you are fighting something not trivial.

I’m 100% confident. I, unlike you, apparently understand how melee damage works in this game. It is a function of your attack, the mobs level, the mobs ac, your strength etc. the closer the mob is to your level, the more important relative attack (influenced directly by strength) is.

This is pretty basic NerdQuest knowledge man.

Go find a good dark blue mob and repeat.

Fighting two different mobs with the same ac but different levels - you will land hits more reliably and for a higher DI on the lower level mob.

In two instances of fighting the same mob with the same level and the same ac - you will land higher DI spreads the more attack (influenced by strength) you have.

You have chosen an extraordinary (not typical) level 5 mob. You have such a dramatic level advantage that your parse is not fully relevant. There is still value in the parse but your data would be more meaningful vs a more realistic target.

Please repeat your methods on a mob that is not 55 levels below you.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Fighting two different mobs with the same ac but different levels - you will land hits more reliably and for a higher DI on the lower level mob.

In two instances of fighting the same mob with the same level and the same ac - you will land higher DI spreads the more attack (influenced by strength) you have.

You have chosen an extraordinary (not typical) level 5 mob.

Please repeat your methods on a mob that is not 55 levels below you.

Please explain what you meant here:

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

"Max hits are gonna happen all the damn time when you parse vs a level 5 mob."

If you read my post https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...&postcount=105 , you would see I got 11 max hits out of 496 hits on said level 5 mob. That is a 2.2% chance of getting a max hit. This data is directly contradicting your point.

Are you conceding that you were incorrect on this point?

I am still waiting for you to provide the formulas you are using, as well as the data you are plugging in to said formulas. This should be an easy one for you if this is "basic knowledge".

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Jimjam [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The low hit rate on turtle means it has high avoidance, not high ac.



At level 60 your attack is gonna be squelching the targets defence (unless it also has insane ac, which i suppose is likely) no matter the str. I’m actually amazed there was a discernable difference at all. I suppose that comes down to the slight improvement to max hit.

Your test basically completely eliminates the attack vs ac comparison, into which str plays a role.

Again, what you do not understand is that additional mitigation will not increase the DPS difference between 160 and 180 strength. That isn't how the formulas work.

If a mob is mitigating 20% more damage based on ac, level, etc., you will simply do 20% less damage.

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If a mob is mitigating 20% more damage based on ac, level, etc., you will simply do 20% less damage.

Base damage is static. If you hit you get all of it.
Damage bonus is static. If you hit, you get all of it.
Damage interval (1-20) is what is affected in the level vs level, attack vs ac

Mobs don’t just mitigate dmg a flat percent with level and ac, they accomplish this by lowering the average DI and also influencing your relative chance to hit.

We know how much per swing damage strength gives you - that’s not hard to calculate/parse and your parse does demonstrate this.

But str doesn’t just affect swing damage, it also directly influences attack.

What your parse on a level 5 anomaly doesn’t do is accurately give a picture of how the “fancy dance” between mob level/ac and your level/attack impact damage output. The level variance is simply too high. You chose a convenient but inappropriate target.

Go find a solid dark blue (preferably a few levels above the blue/green threshold) and run a few cycles. You are a sk and can FD to reset the mob, a distinct advantage for parse comparison as you are literally using the same exact mob in each round.

You, as a sk, are in the unique position to control every variable and keep everything but your strength value identical.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It will lower your total dps yes. It will widen the dps gap when you are fighting something not trivial.

I’m 100% confident. I, unlike you, apparently understand how melee damage works in this game. It is a function of your attack, the mobs level, the mobs ac, your strength etc. the closer the mob is to your level, the more important relative attack (influenced directly by strength) is.

This is pretty basic NerdQuest knowledge man.

This is simply not true. If the DPS difference is 3, and overall DPS is reduced by 25%, the difference is also reduced by 25%. I showed that here https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...&postcount=105

You won't provide evidence that shows the contrary, since that is your normal behavior. Please stop lying and trolling, it just hurts other people reading this.

[Troxx]

I don’t think you’re reading. Fighting a level 5 mob you are going to get a much more favorable hit spread (base damage + 1-20DI) than fighting a level appropriate mob. Damage bonus remains identical regardless and is a function of your level and weapon delay for 2 handers.

If fighting a level appropriate mob your average DI (1-20) per hit will be higher with 20 extra strength. That 3% will be bigger when more strength skews your damage interval to higher intervals with higher relative attack vs the mobs ac.

Max hits are gonna happen all the damn time when you parse vs a level 5 mob.

It’s not just about max hit.

This is basic NerdQuest knowledge.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don’t think you’re reading. Fighting a level 5 mob you are going to get a much more favorable hit spread (base damage + 1-20DI) than fighting a level appropriate mob. Damage bonus remains identical regardless and is a function of your level and weapon delay for 2 handers.

If fighting a level appropriate mob your average DI (1-20) per hit will be higher with 20 extra strength. That 3% will be bigger when more strength skews your damage interval to higher intervals with higher relative attack vs the mobs ac.

Max hits are gonna happen all the damn time when you parse vs a level 5 mob.

It’s not just about max hit.

This is basic NerdQuest knowledge.

If you think you understand the formulas better, please post the formulas you are using and plug in the data so we can see what you are referring to. Or you can provide a video of your own showing a different DPS difference. Simply saying "I am right, and you are wrong" is irrelevant. I have provided actual in-game data here: https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...&postcount=105. You have provided nothing but trolling.

I don't even understand what you mean by "Max hits are gonna happen all the damn time when you parse vs a level 5 mob."

If you read my post, you would see I got 11 max hits out of 496 hits on said level 5 mob lol. That is a 2.2% chance of getting a max hit. A far cry from "gonna happen all the damn time". If you are incorrect on the assumption that max hits are going to happen more often on a low level mob, perhaps you are wrong in your other assumptions too?

[Lune]

DSM is just clearly not intellectually qualified to be dealing with this.

What a shame because he's gonna keep flooding the forum with bad advice stated confidently.