Stop the Socking

[Wenuven]

I didn't read all 10 pages of this crap because I'm not involved in the raid scene yet, but...

There are what, 13 guilds in Class R? Getting rid of trackers or adjusting the variance is never going to solve the problem that there are way too many guilds competing for the same targets.

Reduce the spawn times. Dramatically. Get rid of FTE for 90% of the targets and put everyone on a very clear rotation. Everyone wins.

It's not classic. But neither is the server. Many things about the environment here are WORLDS apart from how they were in classic. Sure you are going to put way more raid loot onto the server. But there are also way more raiders here to begin with.

I don't think ANYONE actually wants poopsocking to be a necessary part of raiding on this server. So why not just do something to actually solve the problem instead of dancing around the "it's not classic" excuse while everyone is constantly at each other's throats over the raid scene.

[arsenalpow]

Originally Posted by Wenuven [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I didn't read all 10 pages of this crap because I'm not involved in the raid scene yet, but...

There are what, 13 guilds in Class R? Getting rid of trackers or adjusting the variance is never going to solve the problem that there are way too many guilds competing for the same targets.

Reduce the spawn times. Dramatically. Get rid of FTE for 90% of the targets and put everyone on a very clear rotation. Everyone wins.

It's not classic. But neither is the server. Many things about the environment here are WORLDS apart from how they were in classic. Sure you are going to put way more raid loot onto the server. But there are also way more raiders here to begin with.

I don't think ANYONE actually wants poopsocking to be a necessary part of raiding on this server. So why not just do something to actually solve the problem instead of dancing around the "it's not classic" excuse while everyone is constantly at each other's throats over the raid scene.

Just to set you straight, there's about 10 guilds willing to rotate our third of the pie and two other guilds holding the server hostage

[Wenuven]

Originally Posted by arsenalpow [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Just to set you straight, there's about 10 guilds willing to rotate our third of the pie and two other guilds holding the server hostage

Forgive me, I'm somewhat new here. What I interpret you saying is that all class R guilds are willing to rotate, but IB and TMO are poopsocking all the FTE targets for themselves?

[arsenalpow]

Originally Posted by Wenuven [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Forgive me, I'm somewhat new here. What I interpret you saying is that all class R guilds are willing to rotate, but IB and TMO are poopsocking all the FTE targets for themselves?

Yes.

[Korben]

Originally Posted by Wenuven [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I didn't read all 10 pages of this crap because I'm not involved in the raid scene yet, but...

There are what, 13 guilds in Class R? Getting rid of trackers or adjusting the variance is never going to solve the problem that there are way too many guilds competing for the same targets.

Reduce the spawn times. Dramatically. Get rid of FTE for 90% of the targets and put everyone on a very clear rotation. Everyone wins.

It's not classic. But neither is the server. Many things about the environment here are WORLDS apart from how they were in classic. Sure you are going to put way more raid loot onto the server. But there are also way more raiders here to begin with.

I don't think ANYONE actually wants poopsocking to be a necessary part of raiding on this server. So why not just do something to actually solve the problem instead of dancing around the "it's not classic" excuse while everyone is constantly at each other's throats over the raid scene.

Maybe we need people like this guy who's hearts aren't so tainted by the poop in their socks and the pixels in their bags.

He's got very good point, and the raiding population on this server is grossly in excess of what this content was designed to accommodate.

What if all respawn timers were made classic, then cut by 2/3rds, and given +/- 1 hour variance?

Numbers are rough but this lets more people get more loot and is somewhat of a scaleable way to handle the mass demand for these mobs.

Exclude VP or let the guilds who could handle VP come up with VP specific rules, since that's it's own beast.

[-Catherin-]

Originally Posted by Korben [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Maybe we need people like this guy who's hearts aren't so tainted by the poop in their socks and the pixels in their bags.

He's got very good point, and the raiding population on this server is grossly in excess of what this content was designed to accommodate.

What if all respawn timers were made classic, then cut by 2/3rds, and given +/- 1 hour variance?

Numbers are rough but this lets more people get more loot and is somewhat of a scaleable way to handle the mass demand for these mobs.

Exclude VP or let the guilds who could handle VP come up with VP specific rules, since that's it's own beast.

Id like to see a number of things like this to happen but the issue is that staff has made pretty clear to us is that they are not considering anything that requires more changes to the code. They want us to all learn how to play nice and come to an agreement together.

[Korben]

Originally Posted by -Catherin- [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Id like to see a number of things like this to happen but the issue is that staff has made pretty clear to us is that they are not considering anything that requires more changes to the code. They want us to all learn how to play nice and come to an agreement together.

Originally Posted by Joyelle [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I remember this type of thing being proposed before, but ultimately the upper echelon of the raid scene shot it down because the argument was that it would devalue their pixels. I'm pretty sure people have even proposed it with greatly diminished loot tables and it was met with a wall of Not Classic.

Catherin,

What if the answer is we can't play nicely together?

Joyelle,

Same sort of question. If people can't play nicely together because they don't want their pixels devalued, I think we've identified the problem.



When the overwhelming majority of the server is mostly(I fucking said mostly, please don't nit pick) in agreeable position on how to handle a situation that has been so hotly debated, and a very small portion of the server is unwilling to budge because of their irrational fears of lootflation, isn't it an easy decision to do what benefits the overwhelming majority, who can concede certain points to the "other side" in pursuit of a better environment for all?

[-Catherin-]

Originally Posted by Korben [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Catherin,

What if the answer is we can't play nicely together?

I don't know [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] Only way is to find a way to convince staff, but they seem to have taken a pretty hard stance on no code change.

I don't have much faith in the two classes coming together on anything either, as we are basically worlds apart on how we think the game should be enjoyed. And I personally think any change will have to be code too.

[Erati]

Originally Posted by Korben [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Catherin,

What if the answer is we can't play nicely together?

Joyelle,

Same sort of question. If people can't play nicely together because they don't want their pixels devalued, I think we've identified the problem.



When the overwhelming majority of the server is mostly(I fucking said mostly, please don't nit pick) in agreeable position on how to handle a situation that has been so hotly debated, and a very small portion of the server is unwilling to budge because of their irrational fears of lootflation, isn't it an easy decision to do what benefits the overwhelming majority, who can concede certain points to the "other side" in pursuit of a better environment for all?

Its how we got to the current ruleset we have today.

and that was pulling teeth....

Theres not going to be much in the way of 'benefiting the overwhelming majority' because in the more hardcore's mindset and eyes they were the only ones giving up things ( spawns ) with any agreement.

So while the casual community has the 'majority' of the playerbase, the problem is they have no bargaining chips that the hardcores want or wanted rather since they are the ones who controlled all the raid targets.

Since casuals did not have much to offer that the hardcores werent already getting 100% of, there was very little movement with anyone's proposals til the Staff stepped in and slapped each side around.

[wwoneo]

Originally Posted by Korben [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

When the overwhelming majority of the server is mostly(I fucking said mostly, please don't nit pick) in agreeable position on how to handle a situation that has been so hotly debated, and a very small portion of the server is unwilling to budge because of their irrational fears of lootflation, isn't it an easy decision to do what benefits the overwhelming majority, who can concede certain points to the "other side" in pursuit of a better environment for all?

This is starting to sound an awful lot like a World of Warcraft Motto/Mission Statement.