Game Mechanics: T-staff proc in PvP

[Rettii]

Originally Posted by compulsion [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

9 pages of flames and opinions on how the game should be, with like 3 people actually citing evidence from live. This seems like one of those items that blue players love because it makes the game so easy, just like the old sword of runes. Proc rate was 10x or higher than it was on live and everyone just abused it to get their loots faster.

So anyhow... if a t-staff monk is basically the most fearsome class on this server, you would imagine monks would really dominate PvP on live, where they would be immune to roots and easily partial the rest with just resist buffs and a few plat diamond rings(avg price 4000 in 2001).

http://web.archive.org/web/200112050...sz_summary.jsp

Wait, what? So 4 months into the server, after evil team got to xp and farm uninterrupted in KC for the first 2 months, only 1 single monk appears in the points leaders(#56 of 60). As a matter of fact, monks are below warriors and rogues in class representation on the SZ leaderboards and are tied with paladins who did not have one single offensive option in the classic resist system.

If live was like this server, evil monks would have been steamrolling everyone with high unresistable damage and a t-staff that procs so often it is basically a stunlock. Since the exact opposite is true and monks appear to have been shit on live PvP, it appears that the t-staff code on this server is completely wrong.

"The DD part of the Proc always happens, the Stun though still not stun Unstunnable Mobs. The Consensus on Monkly Business seems to be that the Stun Lasts for 3 6 or 12 seconds, depending on the mob's level. If you Duel with it it tends to stun other toons for 12."

"Yeah, I must admit I like the 120 DD part never being resisted. As far as I am concerned the Stun part is pretty much a joke anyway, 80% percent of the time it wears off instantly, there was even a time right after a patch you would get the 'wears off' message before the proc message. I have heard that max duration on the stun is supposed to be 12 seconds, but in the year I have had mine I have see that all of about once, usually more in the few seconds time frame if it happens at all"

"The proc rate is very high unresistable , 120dd + 1 - 6 secs stun , but similar like common root series spells , you will recieve a spell fade message from mobs. But , why mobs always start to move or attack before the spell fade message appear?"

I am guessing that someone read that the proc is unresistable, which originally was only the damage, and made the stun as unresistable as well. From castersrealm, jan of 2001(6 mos after kunark release)

http://web.archive.org/web/200205221...em.asp?Id=1255

"Effect Details: This effect causes the target to be stunned while it is rained down with blows delivering 120 hitpoints in damage. It is unresistable. The stun is a variable duration from 1-10 seconds. On high level mobs (54+) it is usually just an instant stun and they wont stay stunned, but will still be interrupted if casting. "

So, according to a credible (castersrealm and allakhazam being *the* EQ resources at the time) period specific source, the duration of the stun should only be 1-10 seconds. Player comments from the era suggest the same thing. On this server the stun is always max duration and according to multiple sources, is also max duration on mobs that it should only act as an interrupt on.

As an aside,



While this should be true, procs here seem to frontload. The old sword of runes would fire off multiple procs before the first melee swing even landed. The t-staff and the ranger conflag dagger both proc multiple times at the onset of melee. The t-staff not only almost always procs in the initial swings, but it reliably procs again before the first stun has worn.

Winner winner chicken dinner. Give this guy a promotion.

Originally Posted by compulsion [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Anyone remember shit like this from live? How unstoppable would Nizzar be if he was completely immune to CC and any damage spell that wasn't lure based. The only way that a monk goes from being the worst PvP class in the game on live, to the best PvP class in the game on this emu, is because the t-staff is incorrectly coded.

And now, what EQ PvP was always meant to be...

[Smedy]

wait until theres a ranger with windstriker and get back to me, you can atleast avoid being hit from a tstaff [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

shit's classic dog, and yes tstaff was unresistable 12 second (i think maybe even 18 seconds on live) you might not have gotten to play vs a monk with tstaff on live, cause shit was rare as fuck.

[compulsion]

Originally Posted by Smedy [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

wait until theres a ranger with windstriker and get back to me, you can atleast avoid being hit from a tstaff [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

shit's classic dog, and yes tstaff was unresistable 12 second (i think maybe even 18 seconds on live) you might not have gotten to play vs a monk with tstaff on live, cause shit was rare as fuck.

You should let the good people over at castersrealm who detailed the item in 2001 know that they are wrong. "shit's classic dog" should be all they need to issue a formal apology to you and everyone else for having the item info completely wrong for the last 12 years.

Which scenario is more likely:

A: T-staff was such a well kept secret on live that monks on Sullon Zek didn't use them, and that is why they were tied(with paladins) for least representation of any class on the PvP leaderboards.

B: T-staff here is incorrectly coded and so overpowered that players have gotten used to it being a crutch and just organize their entire PvP groups around t-staff equipped monks.

PS: In the spirit of evidence supported, rational discussion, could we get some evidence for "(i think maybe even 18 seconds on live)"? We all just want to get this thing right after all.

[SamwiseRed]

Originally Posted by compulsion [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You should let the good people over at castersrealm who detailed the item in 2001 know that they are wrong. "shit's classic dog" should be all they need to issue a formal apology to you and everyone else for having the item info completely wrong for the last 12 years.

Which scenario is more likely:

A: T-staff was such a well kept secret on live that monks on Sullon Zek didn't use them, and that is why they were tied(with paladins) for least representation of any class on the PvP leaderboards.

B: T-staff here is incorrectly coded and so overpowered that players have gotten used to it being a crutch and just organize their entire PvP groups around t-staff equipped monks.

PS: In the spirit of evidence supported, rational discussion, could we get some evidence for "(i think maybe even 18 seconds on live)"? We all just want to get this thing right after all.

SZ came out after kunark (in velious) so the t staff we had on there was already nerfed ( I THINK NOT 100%) also it was rare as fuck and not many monks. this class relies on a proc to kill most people 1v1 so it wasnt too appealing on SZ when you had manaburning wizards all over the fuckin place. fuck the police.

[Vayder]

Originally Posted by SamwiseRed [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

SZ came out after kunark (in velious) so the t staff we had on there was already nerfed ( I THINK NOT 100%) also it was rare as fuck and not many monks. this class relies on a proc to kill most people 1v1 so it wasnt too appealing on SZ when you had manaburning wizards all over the fuckin place. fuck the police.

That would be great except:

1) When was t-staff ever nerfed? I'd like to see the patch notes on that one.
2) There were no manaburning wizards when the chart linked was posted


The SZ leaderboards are a pretty strong statement I think. They show pretty much what we see here currently (druids and wizards are good) with the strong exception that monks are nowhere near elite status on the SZ boards and are pretty sick here.

[Bamzal Sherbet]

i recently discovered quotes of players discussing the stun in detail. it would stun for the first two seconds. at the same time it acts as a root-spin for (1 to 2) procs (6-12 seconds). during the root-spin you can melee, cast, etc

[Nirgon]

Okay, so what does it do on EQMac?

I had access to Ketov the iksar monk on live who had one. I can't remember either way on it despite having proc'd it. I sorta remember yondering after being stunned... Jinxat proc'd it on me fighting me in Lavastorm... test on EQ Mac! I feel like it wasn't as gamebreaking as it is here but still very strong. Maybe 2-3 second stun, root+spin for rest of duration..

[heartbrand]

lol smedy quote kinda funny I had him ignored tbh

[Tippett]

shits classic stop crying about it and go farm one and roll a monk if you think its so great

also why the fuck is this thread in bug discussion?

classic mechanics are not bugs

[Tavrin]

Originally Posted by Tippett [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

shits classic stop crying about it and go farm one and roll a monk if you think its so great

also why the fuck is this thread in bug discussion?

classic mechanics are not bugs

Because people do not believe that the current T Staff is classic. All evidence from the kunark/velious era shows the proc being an interrupt on 54+ mobs, and a variable 1-12 second stun on everything else.

Here is a link to allakhazam in December of 2001, the comments date back to May 2001.

http://web.archive.org/web/200112241....html?item=572

Specific comment from May 2001:

"And lets not forget to mention that the proc is UNRESISTABLE , Nothing can resist it, on the mobs like 54+ it doesnt stune them but it will interupt there casting. Its a 120DD and a 1 to 12 second stun. Im 47 and got lucky and won a roll on it the other day in karnors (yahhhooo) I about had a heart attack, glad I got my IFS the week b4 and started pracing 2hb was at 50, now im at 212, cant wait to proc time :O) "

And another:

"k, we all know the issues that monks have with weight. Frankly, I like the fact that I can hit for 115 (at level 43) with just under 200 skill in 2hb better then I would like those few extra ac points. The proc is a 120 point unresistable dd from what I understand, as well as a up to 12 second stun. At this point I don't give a rats ass that I'm at 18 weight. With this thing I beat stuff up, end of story."

Please provide evidence that the stun was always 12 seconds if you wish to support your claim that the current tstaff is 'classic' and not a bug.