most underpowered class in game?

[PlsNoBan]

Originally Posted by eqravenprince [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Raiding on p99 sucks.

FTFY

[eqravenprince]

Originally Posted by PlsNoBan [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

FTFY

We are on a P99 forum after all... kind of implied =)

[Tunabros]

the bad men took eqravenprince's pixels and he's mad

[socialist]

Like a decade ago, I suggested some form of instancing. Not like the wholesale AoC shit from TLPs, but maybe three serverwide instances of raid zones and then people would have to lock themselves into one of them and compete for content within it. Instead we got a janky system of rotations that nobody likes, and it remains a sever where almost nobody gets to raid for real. In other words, raiding on P99 does suck and there was always a much better solution that nobody cared to look into.

[Zoolander]

Originally Posted by socialist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Like a decade ago, I suggested some form of instancing. Not like the wholesale AoC shit from TLPs, but maybe three serverwide instances of raid zones and then people would have to lock themselves into one of them and compete for content within it. Instead we got a janky system of rotations that nobody likes, and it remains a sever where almost nobody gets to raid for real. In other words, raiding on P99 does suck and there was always a much better solution that nobody cared to look into.

whats the difference ?

instancing doesnt change anything bout the game. you just reach endgame / your goals faster and quit reroll after anyways.

classic eq is p99. instanced eq is daybreak. pick your poison.

[Heywood]

Rangers is the only correct answer.


They can't do anything better that another class can, apart from tracking.

They can't tank, unless weaponshield. But A monk/sk/pal are more reliable.

They can't dps, unless BFG and trushot. Rogues, monks, even wars are better.

They can snare/root. Druid can do that.

In pvp, they're not strong unless they have BiS gear and a windy. Even then they can't stand toe to toe against a melee class.

SoN and CotP are great tho. will give them that.

[Raj]

Originally Posted by Heywood [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Rangers is the only correct answer.


They can't do anything better that another class can, apart from tracking.

They can't tank, unless weaponshield. But A monk/sk/pal are more reliable.

They can't dps, unless BFG and trushot. Rogues, monks, even wars are better.

They can snare/root. Druid can do that.

In pvp, they're not strong unless they have BiS gear and a windy. Even then they can't stand toe to toe against a melee class.

SoN and CotP are great tho. will give them that.

But properly equipped Rangers, Bards, Shamans, clerics, rogues can all tank Exp content for groups up to 60 when geared for HP/AC/resists(situationally) against ENC/SHM slowed mobs. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] Rogue is the worst of those due to needing good DEX and relying on procs OR abusing root proximity aggro and essentially tanking warrior/monk style but worse.

A good Boneknight necro can prob tank ENC/SHM slowed mobs for groups a long time too, maybe up to 60? I unfortunately have not seen many necro tanks as they seem to usually prefer their solo or small group exps but know it is possible.

[PlsNoBan]

Originally Posted by Heywood [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Rangers is the only correct answer.


They can't do anything better that another class can, apart from tracking.

They can't tank, unless weaponshield. But A monk/sk/pal are more reliable.

They can't dps, unless BFG and trushot. Rogues, monks, even wars are better.

They can snare/root. Druid can do that.

In pvp, they're not strong unless they have BiS gear and a windy. Even then they can't stand toe to toe against a melee class.

SoN and CotP are great tho. will give them that.

1: They can tank quite a bit pre-raid and provide some of the best snap threat in the game last I checked. Unless flame lick has been changed since I last played?

2: Their DPS is fine. Their sustained dps is respectable in group settings. Not the best but certainly not the worst. Are they topping parses in raids? Probably not. Who cares?

3: Druid does less sustained damage. Has arguably less important buffs. Can't hold a candle to clr/shm heals. They can definitely snare and root tho u right.

4: Nobody cares about PvP at all. See population of any EQ PvP server.


Druid still worse class

[socialist]

Originally Posted by Heywood [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Rangers is the only correct answer.
In pvp, they're not strong unless they have BiS gear and a windy. Even then they can't stand toe to toe against a melee class.

I don't agree with that part. Rangers are actually very good in PvP. In group situations, they can participate in a melee train just fine, even if they aren't necessarily optimal for it. All that matters in group PvP is having more swinging dicks in your melee train than the opponent does. In solo 1v1 world PvP, rangers have great tools available to them.

A ranger might not beat a warrior in a 1:1 mathematical joust, but if you make use of your ranged options, it's perfectly winnable. Same goes for any other melee matchup. You have access to viable two-handed weapons, and if you fall behind in the joust, you can resort to shooting and quick-casting spells between clashes. Ensnare is super good against pets as it lasts like fifteen minutes and largely removes a pet from the equation.

Against casters, you've got solid melee output as well as strong FR/CR buffs, and you have the ability to shoot someone from outside conventional spellcasting range. Nobody can really run from you. You can't stop somebody from gating, but you can't be fought in the manner that casters normally fight melees because you have the option of just standing two hundred units of range away and shooting the dude over and over for 50-100 damage a pop. Nobody can stand up to that very long.

Being one of three classes with SoW is super nice on a PvP server as well. In theory, anyone can just buy SoW potions; but in reality, you get dispelled so much in PvP that most people just make do with jboots. Having that extra 10% movement speed is a huge advantage. Your own SoW might get dispelled, but just the fact that you always have the buff at the start of a fight means you always have a mobility advantage or at least parity (against druids and shamans) while almost everyone you fight will only have jboots speed. This matters way more for a melee class than for casters.

And while your offensive spells aren't exactly amazing, you do have quick-casting nukes and near-unresistable DoTs. They don't hurt a lot, but they do damage, so you're not completely incapable of doing anything to someone you can't get to in melee the way warriors, rogues, monks and paladins are. Among the melee classes, only rangers and shadowknights have the ability to apply pressure from range. When someone levitates off of a cliff just to counter your melee attacks, you can still put Drones of Doom on him, spam your fast fire nukes, and shoot a bow. It'll land you some kills from time to time where other melee classes had no such options.

For overall PvP, meaning not specifically group PvP or focused fully on 1v1 duels, ranger is a great class. It's good enough to partake in a melee train and it has perfectly fine matchups against all classes in random world 1v1s. When jousting against tankier melee classes, just get some distance and heal yourself from time to time, or get off bowshots in-between jousting clashes. Against casters, the ability to self-buff +40 FR/CR is a pretty big thing that allows you to focus more on MR, and no caster class can do much against any melee opponent with high enough resists.

And while ranger heals aren't particularly big, just the ability to heal yourself up after every fight means you're never in that awful situations where you're down to 60% HP and have to sit around for fifteen minutes to regenerate, hoping nobody finds you. Any class without healing spells has to deal with that when not in a group. Ask a PvP warrior how much it sucks to do anything alone just because it takes absolutely forever to regain HP after every fight.

[Imago]

Originally Posted by socialist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't agree with that part. Rangers are actually very good in PvP. In group situations, they can participate in a melee train just fine, even if they aren't necessarily optimal for it. All that matters in group PvP is having more swinging dicks in your melee train than the opponent does. In solo 1v1 world PvP, rangers have great tools available to them.

A ranger might not beat a warrior in a 1:1 mathematical joust, but if you make use of your ranged options, it's perfectly winnable. Same goes for any other melee matchup. You have access to viable two-handed weapons, and if you fall behind in the joust, you can resort to shooting and quick-casting spells between clashes. Ensnare is super good against pets as it lasts like fifteen minutes and largely removes a pet from the equation.

Against casters, you've got solid melee output as well as strong FR/CR buffs, and you have the ability to shoot someone from outside conventional spellcasting range. Nobody can really run from you. You can't stop somebody from gating, but you can't be fought in the manner that casters normally fight melees because you have the option of just standing two hundred units of range away and shooting the dude over and over for 50-100 damage a pop. Nobody can stand up to that very long.

Being one of three classes with SoW is super nice on a PvP server as well. In theory, anyone can just buy SoW potions; but in reality, you get dispelled so much in PvP that most people just make do with jboots. Having that extra 10% movement speed is a huge advantage. Your own SoW might get dispelled, but just the fact that you always have the buff at the start of a fight means you always have a mobility advantage or at least parity (against druids and shamans) while almost everyone you fight will only have jboots speed. This matters way more for a melee class than for casters.

And while your offensive spells aren't exactly amazing, you do have quick-casting nukes and near-unresistable DoTs. They don't hurt a lot, but they do damage, so you're not completely incapable of doing anything to someone you can't get to in melee the way warriors, rogues, monks and paladins are. Among the melee classes, only rangers and shadowknights have the ability to apply pressure from range. When someone levitates off of a cliff just to counter your melee attacks, you can still put Drones of Doom on him, spam your fast fire nukes, and shoot a bow. It'll land you some kills from time to time where other melee classes had no such options.

For overall PvP, meaning not specifically group PvP or focused fully on 1v1 duels, ranger is a great class. It's good enough to partake in a melee train and it has perfectly fine matchups against all classes in random world 1v1s. When jousting against tankier melee classes, just get some distance and heal yourself from time to time, or get off bowshots in-between jousting clashes. Against casters, the ability to self-buff +40 FR/CR is a pretty big thing that allows you to focus more on MR, and no caster class can do much against any melee opponent with high enough resists.

And while ranger heals aren't particularly big, just the ability to heal yourself up after every fight means you're never in that awful situations where you're down to 60% HP and have to sit around for fifteen minutes to regenerate, hoping nobody finds you. Any class without healing spells has to deal with that when not in a group. Ask a PvP warrior how much it sucks to do anything alone just because it takes absolutely forever to regain HP after every fight.

This makes my dick hard for Red 2.0