More Bard Questions

[Robdukes]

You probably already know this seeing as your a high level bard but for those who don't yet. The song will take effect if you turn it off and start the next when the cast bar is at the final 5-8% (rough estimate). When I'm doing the 4 song twist I never let the cast bar go all the way to the end before clicking off. If you do then you get the dropped song often. Only time I get a dropped song is when either the cast bar vanishes or I get a missed note. Also If my hand starts cramping up after many hours.

It might even be as high as 10% left on the cast bar. I just have a sense for it now so I can't say for sure.

[Goseals6]

Originally Posted by t0lkien [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'm sorry, but years of playing on live show this not to be true for me. I can never keep four songs up reliably and have never seen another Bard do it either. This is easy to show if you stand somewhere and just twist four songs that have icons. One will inevitably start dropping (they'll rotate naturally). If it's different on p99... well it's different. On live that's how it was. I'll test this on p99 now for confirmation. Hang tight.

• Yep confirmed as the same on p99 for me. A four song twist has icons dropping. You guys are either theory crafting and not observing it ingame, or my ping is making the difference (though I can't see how that's true as it's consistent), or there is some other factor at work that I'm not aware of. I don't know what to else to say...
  
  Here's a challenge though - keep up a four song twist reliably over a minute or two and post the fraps video.

I wouldn't suggest using fraps to video anything especially a monster kite. Xsplit then stream it if you can handle the bandwidth.

Also, it's possible you can twist four songs if you set up the stop cast macro and only push two buttons instead of four. However, taking latency into consideration, it's possible that even with using that method, your songs will fall off with a fraction of a second difference.

In my opinion, twisting more than 3 really puts yourself at risk if selo's drops. You're pretty much hosed if it happens, or unless you keep a stack of sow potions.(wait are those on the p99 server?)

[t0lkien]

Guys, no offense, but it's all just forum spam until we see a video. I'm saying it's not possible, even with a perfect ping (by not possible I mean the songs will all drop briefly, and that's even if the ping is perfect and there are no resists/missed notes). Please prove me wrong though. My experience and testing hold this to be true.

[Rhambuk]

ive played a bard casually and i can keep 4 up at once. not for 2 minutes straight and without some song loss but it is possible to have 4 at once.

didnt read all f it so im sure to have missed something. i dont have nor know to run fraps. ha now ill get trained ksd and ninja looted because people know i dot fraps [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[t0lkien]

Fraps or it didn't happen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Seriously, I don't believe you guys. Thott didn't either by the way (http://www.afterlifeguild.org/Thott/powercurves.php):

The reason that bards can do decent damage around level 50 even with the flat curve is that the songs themselves limit a bard prior to level 46. Before 46 a bard doesn't have 3 decent damage songs to sing, so damage is limited to just 2/3 of what it could be based on the curve. So the curve increases in max possible damage output with a more normal shape due to when the songs become available. Yet a bard is surely singing three songs, a decent bard is at least, prior to 46, so switching from 2 to 3 damage songs isn't an increase in damage, it's trading something else the bard was singing for damage. It increases the speed, not the efficiency, of damage the bard can do. And thus the graphed curve is accurate, and it's flat.

I.E. Three songs is the standard full twist. And as I said, that is proveable just by standing there and twisting 4 icon songs. Show me the video of a solid four song twist over a few minutes, or honestly, it's all theorycrafting.

Originally Posted by Robdukes [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You probably already know this seeing as your a high level bard but for those who don't yet. The song will take effect if you turn it off and start the next when the cast bar is at the final 5-8% (rough estimate). When I'm doing the 4 song twist I never let the cast bar go all the way to the end before clicking off. If you do then you get the dropped song often. Only time I get a dropped song is when either the cast bar vanishes or I get a missed note. Also If my hand starts cramping up after many hours.

It might even be as high as 10% left on the cast bar. I just have a sense for it now so I can't say for sure.

P.S. This is not true either. Kiting Bards already know this, but for me, I have to wait a bit after the cast bar has gone to full and disappeared to be certain that the song has hit - in the case of kiting, Selos particularly. I have died several times because the cast bar finished (it's client side) but the song had not hit ingame, and I started the twist on my AoE song. Selos timed out, I lost runspeed, and died a horrible though rapid death. The only way to get around this is to wait until the particle effect shows in game (effects are triggered server-side) to be certain a song has hit.

That's great design by the way, as it forces you to watch the onscreen action and not play the UI.

[Robdukes]

After some investigation I suppose It's not true. I guess I'm just good at clicking it off at the exact end of the bar. The split second that a song drops when you miss the exact end of the bar is only a big deal if the 4th song is a vital one..like guardian rhythms. When I fear kite with chain..fear...drum dot 1....drum dot 2. When I get back to chain its not dropped. So a 4 song twist is really reliant upon which songs your playing.

[Robdukes]

It may not be true when your kiting a bunch of mobs around and have lag issues but I do it all the time. I'll log on now and investigate.

[t0lkien]

You can have six or more song effects up at one time for an instant. That's not the point. The issue is maintaining a stable four song twist. Come on, this isn't rocket science. I'm saying a permanent stable four song twist is not possible without continual song drop i.e. It's not possible.

[Cords]

I think the 3 song vs 4 song twist is kind of funny. If your doing your rotations right 4 songs is no issue. Song one will be flashing when you get back around to it, and your already casting it again, by the time it drops off you have your song back up, and your continue down the line, never really loosing any of your four songs. Now granted it is much easier in a group because your already running at least 3 songs before a pull, in a fight you throw auto attack on, and start running your song rotation. I hot bar my 4 fight songs and it makes it smother, because your not clicking all the time. Raids is standard practice 3 songs. but I think this has been said more then once in this discussion

[SirAlvarex]

Mathematically 5 songs is doable (4 songs + BoH). I haven't played much lately, but when I grouped I'd throw up Regen/Clarity/Haste/Snare+BoH routinely. Snare would never drop because it's a detriment, and regen / haste would only sometimes drop if I got lazy or distracted.

If you are doing non-benificial songs, you can do 5 songs straight up. I do fear+snare+3dots all the time. If you're real good, you can do 6 songs at once, which would be 3 AE's dots + 3 single target dots for some nice DPS (with instrument swapping). Same goes for Mez. It's easy to keep 5 non-resist happy mobs locked down indefinitely.

But if I need to keep 3 songs up all the time, for like resistance fights, I only twist those 3 songs (with BoH since no epic) to ensure there are no dropoffs of coverage.