And I raaaaaan, I raaaan so far awaaaayyyy

[hatelore]

The fte rule in its current form ( I thinks it's been changed,bended,re-wrote) whatever, is one of the number one reasons that raiding on p1999 sucks hairy donkey nuts... and why alot of players have said f this and quit outright. Fte shouts etc can't come quick enough. And ephi, without ct saying the players name or what have you, no one but gm's know exactly which guild has fte, one of the main reasons why fte shout is needed. So the other guild can back off.

So by your logic or interpretation of the rule, as long as you get fte then throw your 7 man raid force at the raid target, you're in the clear? That doesn't seem right...

[Ephi]

Originally Posted by hatelore [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

So by your logic or interpretation of the rule, as long as you get fte then throw your 7 man raid force at the raid target, you're in the clear? That doesn't seem right...

Not at all what I'm saying.

Every situation is judged by its unique circumstances. Hence the reason FE was awarded a VS kill even though they did not technically get FTE in the encounter log.

We do what we can to eliminate all the different variables that could merit a kill to someone who perhaps does not deserve it. But we also make mistakes from time to time. I saw no attempt by FE to actually kill CT. In a 34 second fight, not one other person outside of Scorchin got onto the aggro list.

I made the best call I could, but like I said in fear, if anyone has evidence that speaks against my ruling, Sirken and I would both be happy to review it. You know where to find us.

And if some think I favor one guild or another, you are sorely mistaken. I really have no dog in this fight. Just a volunteer trying to keep the playing grounds as fair as possible. Put another way: I could give a shit about guild XYZ over guild ABC.

[Harazzer]

Originally Posted by Ephi [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Not at all what I'm saying.

Every situation is judged by its unique circumstances. Hence the reason FE was awarded a VS kill even though they did not technically get FTE in the encounter log.

We do what we can to eliminate all the different variables that could merit a kill to someone who perhaps does not deserve it. But we also make mistakes from time to time. I saw no attempt by FE to actually kill CT. In a 34 second fight, not one other person outside of Scorchin got onto the aggro list.

I made the best call I could, but like I said in fear, if anyone has evidence that speaks against my ruling, Sirken and I would both be happy to review it. You know where to find us.

And if some think I favor one guild or another, you are sorely mistaken. I really have no dog in this fight. Just a volunteer trying to keep the playing grounds as fair as possible. Put another way: I could give a shit about guild XYZ over guild ABC.

VS was an entirely different situation. Nothing about that applies here.

In this situation we had a raid force, I got FTE, then TMO Jumped on the mob and killed it. When can you say FTE snipe is any different than initiating a pull and what they did is any different from them KSing it? FTE is supposed to take all of the GM discretion out of a given situation, make it so it is not a call based on favoritism but one of hard evidence. Every other time the FTE situation has come up its "soandso got fte, congrats guild of soandso!" but this time we are all about "the Spirit of FTE" whatever the fuck that is.

And yea, you and every GM in history is an unbiased bastion of blind justice. Never heard that before either.

I don't care about the mob, or the loot which was shitty as i understand it... What i care about is the idea that the precedents and rules of the server can be whimsically overturned by a new GM that can clearly be influenced by cryspam of TMO.

[Alarti0001]

Originally Posted by Harazzer [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

VS was an entirely different situation. Nothing about that applies here.

In this situation we had a raid force, I got FTE, then TMO Jumped on the mob and killed it. When can you say FTE snipe is any different than initiating a pull and what they did is any different from them KSing it? FTE is supposed to take all of the GM discretion out of a given situation, make it so it is not a call based on favoritism but one of hard evidence. Every other time the FTE situation has come up its "soandso got fte, congrats guild of soandso!" but this time we are all about "the Spirit of FTE" whatever the fuck that is.

And yea, you and every GM in history is an unbiased bastion of blind justice. Never heard that before either.

I don't care about the mob, or the loot which was shitty as i understand it... What i care about is the idea that the precedents and rules of the server can be whimsically overturned by a new GM that can clearly be influenced by cryspam of TMO.

Reread his last post. Drui got FTE =)

[Harazzer]

Originally Posted by Alarti0001 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Reread his last post. Drui got FTE =)

Yea you said that before, and in classic alarti fashion I couldn't tell if you were trolling or just that fucking retarded. Apparently its the latter. Clearly he was hit by the zonewide random dt since my name was first on the encounter log. Otherwise it he would have been on the aggro list.

[Tasslehofp99]

Originally Posted by Alarti0001 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Reread his last post. Drui got FTE =)

Then that directly contradicts what was originally stated, as shown in the screenshot posted in the original post of this thread.

[Ephi]

Originally Posted by Harazzer [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

VS was an entirely different situation. Nothing about that applies here.

In this situation we had a raid force, I got FTE, then TMO Jumped on the mob and killed it. When can you say FTE snipe is any different than initiating a pull and what they did is any different from them KSing it? FTE is supposed to take all of the GM discretion out of a given situation, make it so it is not a call based on favoritism but one of hard evidence. Every other time the FTE situation has come up its "soandso got fte, congrats guild of soandso!" but this time we are all about "the Spirit of FTE" whatever the fuck that is.

And yea, you and every GM in history is an unbiased bastion of blind justice. Never heard that before either.

I don't care about the mob, or the loot which was shitty as i understand it... What i care about is the idea that the precedents and rules of the server can be whimsically overturned by a new GM that can clearly be influenced by cryspam of TMO.

Yes, you're right, it's a different situation, although the ruling was based on similar grounds.

And for the record, I received zero tells from any members of TMO before making the ruling. Nor was I watching OOC/Shout. I also helped rule for you guys on the VS kill.

If you think I favor TMO, take it up with Rogean please.

[Happyfeet]

I think you favor halflings. COME AT ME, TRY TO REFUTE THAT!

[Splorf22]

Originally Posted by Ephi [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yes, you're right, it's a different situation, although the ruling was based on similar grounds.

And for the record, I received zero tells from any members of TMO before making the ruling. Nor was I watching OOC/Shout. I also helped rule for you guys on the VS kill.

If you think I favor TMO, take it up with Rogean please.

The question is whether its better to have simple, well-defined rules which are sometimes unfair or to have flexible, more ambiguous rules that attempt to cover more situations correctly. It seems that FE was basically trying to exploit the FTE rules, this offended you, and so you awarded the loot to TMO. I agree that one guild charging a raid mob with another guy sneaking in and trying to FTE snipe is silly. But when you break your own rules you lose credibility.

What this should tell you is that you need to fix the system. There are lots of ways, for example: after a person from guild x gets FTE, the mob enters in to a 'guild seek and destroy mode' where players from other guilds cannot damage the mob or enter its hate list for ~20 seconds. This gives the non-FTE guild time to back off and let the sniper wipe. Or you could ditch FTE and add up damage by guild.

The point is you need something consistent without too much potential for exploitation.

[Autotune]

Originally Posted by Ephi [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Not at all what I'm saying.

Every situation is judged by its unique circumstances. Hence the reason FE was awarded a VS kill even though they did not technically get FTE in the encounter log.

We do what we can to eliminate all the different variables that could merit a kill to someone who perhaps does not deserve it. But we also make mistakes from time to time. I saw no attempt by FE to actually kill CT. In a 34 second fight, not one other person outside of Scorchin got onto the aggro list.

I made the best call I could, but like I said in fear, if anyone has evidence that speaks against my ruling, Sirken and I would both be happy to review it. You know where to find us.

And if some think I favor one guild or another, you are sorely mistaken. I really have no dog in this fight. Just a volunteer trying to keep the playing grounds as fair as possible. Put another way: I could give a shit about guild XYZ over guild ABC.

how much is a guild looking at paying to make you give a shit about them.