Iksar Shaman - Solo Challenges?

[Troxx]

There is no concession, DSM. We are at an impasse. I have posted the rationale. I have backed it up with the kind of napkin-math you value so much. I have proven you wrong. You are simply incapable of thinking outside whatever box you have constructed in your little mind.

Anyone reading this thread can see that.

See you on the flip side?

GIFS may or may not follow.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

There is no concession, DSM. We are at an impasse. I have posted the rationale. I have backed it up with the kind of napkin-math you value so much.

Anyone reading this thread can see that.

See you on the flip side?

GIFS may or may not follow.

You cannot claim we are at an impasse when the facts support my argument. You have currently conceded, even if you want to pretend otherwise. Unfortunately your "napkin math" was flawed, and I showed why. If you want to claim victory, you still need to show my latest math to be flawed https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...&postcount=515 . You have yet to do so. I am glad we had this back and forth, as it honed our data. We were both wrong at times, and learned from each other. You even tried to present some facts for a change, which was great! I consider that a win for the community. You simply fell short in the end and lost, which can happen to anyone.

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You are simply incapable of thinking outside whatever box you have constructed in your little mind.

You need to stop posting nonsense like this. It just ruins any claims you have of "arguing in good faith". If you want to be taken seriously, you need to leave this kind of behavior behind.

[Troxx]

Ok.

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[Duik]

Gif it to me baby. Aaha aha.
And all the ogres say im pretty gay for a straight guy.

[Toxigen]

i aint gay but $20 is $20

[Troxx]

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[bcbrown]

You're still using 2.2DPS for the scourge proc when it should be 0.75DPS.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by bcbrown [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You're still using 2.2DPS for the scourge proc when it should be 0.75DPS.

You're using averages wrong, again. Please learn how to use them. This entire example is using averages, which are backed up by in-game data.

https://wiki.project1999.com/Weapon_Procs - looking at the formula, (75 Base + 60 from Buff) DEX/170 + 0.5 = 1.3 PPM. The JBB Shaman is in melee combat for 116 seconds when accounting for the 16 seconds you are rooting + pet tanking.

This means you are getting 2.4 procs per encounter baseline on average. You divide this number by 2 so you can account for the JBB reducing the number of swings you are doing per minute by half. 1 proc per encounter is a very safe bet. The final PPM value is therefore 0.5. This means you are getting an average of 1 proc halfway through the fight on a 2 minute fight. It's a coin flip per minute. If Heads is Success and Tails is a failure, you end up with these possibilities: [Heads, Tails] = Full DoT DPS. [Tails, Tails] = Zero DoT DPS. [Tails, Heads] = Half DoT DPS. [Heads, Heads] = Full DoT DPS. Averaging that out you have [1, 0, 1, 0.5] / 4 = 62.5% of DoT damage on average.

I'll just put it down to 50%, which is 544 Total DoT Damage / 2 (Half Ticks) + 40 (Direct Damage) = 312 / 132 = 2.36 DPS. When including white damage, the total should be realistically more like 3-4 DPS, but I keep it at 2.2 DPS just because it already works well enough.

The Shaman can also put on more DEX gear to increase their PPM, as they only have 135 DEX in my example.

[bcbrown]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You're using averages wrong, again. Please learn how to use them.

There you go with the insults. Are you that confident that I'm getting my calculations wrong?

You can't just assume a single proc halfway through the fight. Sometimes there will be long stretches with no procs at all - some fights won't have a single proc. Some fights will have multiple procs back to back - these don't double up the damage, though, because it procs a dot, and so procs don't stack.

You can model the procs as a binomial distribution - a series of weighted coin flips. You can then sum the expected damage from each individual swing and take the average of that.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by bcbrown [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

There you go with the insults. Are you that confident that I'm getting my calculations wrong?

It is genuinely not an insult, nor did I mean it as such. I am stating the fact that you have used averages wrong multiple times in this thread, and have yet to correct the behavior.

Originally Posted by bcbrown [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You can't just assume a single proc halfway through the fight. Sometimes there will be long stretches with no procs at all - some fights won't have a single proc. Some fights will have multiple procs back to back - these don't double up the damage, though, because it procs a dot, and so procs don't stack.

Of course! Nor am I denying that is what will happen in individual fights.

Melee combat works the exact same way as weapon procs. 10 DPS is the average in our example, but sometimes individual fights will be 7 DPS, 13 DPS, etc. On a long enough timeline it still averages out to 10 DPS.

The reason why you are using averages wrong is because you are trying to put a single variable using one type of average into an equation using a different type of average. It is an apples to oranges comparison.

You are basically saying "There was one fight were I got zero procs per minute, therefore you are getting 0 DPS from the proc across the average of all fights". It's not correct.