Iksar Shaman - Solo Challenges?

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by Jimjam [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The barbarian shaman 3/4 of the way thru 55 with his mighty hammer?

And yes. The real winner is the barbarian if we acknowledge that getting to 60 and getting torpor and having all that extra time to build dkp and acquire gear is the actual definition of Min/max

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As for me? I like scratching my butt

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[Troxx]

Let’s agree that:

-pet is about 15dps buffed at this level
-mob hp is 4500hp
-mob will do 10dps slowed
-the shaman doesn’t suck so it is slowed before “impact”
-both shamans will be slowing, so remove that from the equation
-both shamans have racial regen/fungi and regrowth

JBB shaman:
15 dps pet + 32.875 dps JBB (48dps)
Fight takes 94 seconds
Mob does 940 damage to the shaman
Shaman regenerated 600 health over 94 seconds
Fight ends with shaman at a net negative 300hp
It will take 45 seconds to regen the lost hp and will recover 150 mana during that time.

Dot shaman:
15 dps pet + 2x ebolts (not bane) will take 133 seconds (pet has to do 2k damage)
30 mana root (Pe not needed)
Mob does 1330 damage to pet
Pet regenerated 1000hp
Shaman regenerated 1019 health
Shaman meditated back 19 ticks = 380 mana passively
Shaman turned that 1019 health back into 500 extra mana
Shaman spent 2 years bolts and 1 roots mana = 670 mana
Shaman ends up with the same net health and 210 surplus mana while pet is down 330 health.

JBB fight? Faster.
2nd fight? Slower but with net gain vs loss. Pet will be regen a good portion of the net deficit back by the time you pull the next.

Interestingly, since you had a net mana gain vs JBB, you can alternate ebolt x2 fights with fights with a single bane and a single ebolt. Every other fight is faster. Bringing down average time to kill a mob and you still squeak closer to a break even point.

This is precisely how I did it. Remember when you’re focused on efficiency you just need to do more total damage than your pet for full xp. As soon as I realized I could kill more mobs over a unit time by not spamming JBB - I sold it.

Then I got epic and none of this mattered anymore.

It does average out faster … well … at least for a troll or iksar.

here is where DSMs shit falls apart

rdy?

2 freshly dinged 56 shaman, 1 ogre spamming jbb and 1 lizard w/ no jbb playing smart

guess who hits 57 in less time /played?

I just showed him the math.

If you want to see the results for an ogre - subtract 7 hp/tick which over a 94 second fight is a net negative of 109 hp … which adds another 24 seconds to the recovery time.

[Toxigen]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I just showed him the math.

If you want to see the results for an ogre - subtract 7 hp/tick which over a 94 second fight is a net negative of 109 hp … which adds another 24 seconds to the recovery time.

now add in a little oopsie daisy here and there where things dont go mathematically perfect and lizardpeepul get better and better

[Tann]

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[Troxx]

Fuck it. I said I wouldn’t but this is fun!

Let’s agree that:

-pet is about 17dps buffed at this level
-mob hp is 7000
-mob will do 10dps slowed
-the shaman doesn’t suck so it is slowed before “impact”
-both shamans will be slowing, so remove that from the equation
-both shamans have racial regen/fungi and regrowth

JBB shaman:
17 dps pet + 32.875 dps JBB (50dps)
Fight takes 140 seconds
Mob does 1400damage to the shaman
Shaman regenerated 920 health over 140 seconds
Fight ends with shaman at a net negative 480hp
It will take 72 seconds to regen the lost hp and will recover 240 mana during that time.

Total time (fight+ recovery) = 212 seconds

Dot shaman:
17 dps pet + 2x ebolts + 1 plague = 188 seconds for pet to do 3.2kdmg
30 mana root (Pe not needed)
Mob does 1880 damage to pet
Pet regenerated 1410hp
Shaman regenerated 1441 health
Shaman meditated back 28 ticks = 560 mana passively
Shaman turned that 1441 health back into 720 extra mana
Shaman spent 2 EB 1 plague and 1 roots mana = 950 mana
Shaman ends up with the same net health and 330 surplus mana while pet is down 470 health.

Total tome (fight+ recovery) = 188 seconds. You are ready to go and can use 175 of that 330 surplus mana to toss a chloroplast on your pet to have the pet “broken even” on health. Heck you still have 155 positive mana so why not use PE instead of root and you still have a whole ‘nother PE’s mana left over in surplus. Or consider it mana left over to compensate for the slow you had to cast or for fizzles/resists over time.

If you’re an ogre, it looks worse for both camps cause no racial regen

So …. 212 seconds for each kill if mad/sad/bad JBB clicking shaman if troll (worse of ogre) vs 188 seconds (worse if ogre)

Well blimey … JBB is slower by 12 fucking percent!

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[Tann]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

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Please keep fighting the good fight by posting the facts, you'll never get through to p99's resident flat Earther, he'll go down with that ship claiming it's not actually sinking, but at least you tried!

[Troxx]

God I hate napkin math, but it’s the only language he speaks.

I can promise it is so much more obvious when you’re actually doing it.

[bcbrown]

A 96 second kill means you can use Enstill instead of Paralyzing Earth. 40 mana savings upfront, and maybe reduce your 15 mana cost of root breaks to 10 mana.

30hp/tick regen on pet means 480hp regen in 96 seconds. 10DPS is 960, so pet is taking 480 damage/fight. This means that as long as you take at least 16 ticks of recovery time, the pet can always be fighting with no interventions. We can remove the extra 100 mana cost for Plague.

I don't think your proc math is right. You're only going to get one swing in per JBB cast. Delay - second conversion is 10, right, so a 47 delay weapon should have one swing every 4.7 seconds? That means you get roughly half as many procs as expected?

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by bcbrown [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

A 96 second kill means you can use Enstill instead of Paralyzing Earth. 40 mana savings upfront, and maybe reduce your 15 mana cost of root breaks to 10 mana.

30hp/tick regen on pet means 480hp regen in 96 seconds. 10DPS is 960, so pet is taking 480 damage/fight. This means that as long as you take at least 16 ticks of recovery time, the pet can always be fighting with no interventions. We can remove the extra 100 mana cost for Plague.

I don't think your proc math is right. You're only going to get one swing in per JBB cast. Delay - second conversion is 10, right, so a 47 delay weapon should have one swing every 4.7 seconds? That means you get roughly half as many procs as expected?

You wouldn't want to use Enstill because it cuts too close to the kill time. If your pet happens to do less DPS from RnG, or you get a spell resist, you will be forced to cast a second Enstill anyway, and 2x enstill's costs 120 mana total. If you need to root a second mob off to the side with enstill, you will also need to cast it again.

Good call on the pet regen. Taking 480 damage per fight means they will be out of a fight 1/4 times instead of 1/3. This is because the pet dies after taking 480 damage 4x times. You will need to remove it from combat periodically even with the regen to prevent it from dying. You wouldn't have your pet in combat at like 10% life for fear of an unlucky double attack. You would do something like 75 mana instead of 100 mana to account for this. It certainly isn't zero.

For proc rates, you are swinging inbetween JBB casts, which is 8 seconds. You are getting half swings, this is true. But a Shaman can buff their DEX. An Ogre Shaman with Mortal Deftness (level 58) would have 130 dex base, assuming no other gear. It would be like 0.75 procs per fight, so you are correct that would be a bit lower.

Thanks for the corrections. It would give like 25 extra mana to the Iksar and maybe 20 less mana to the Ogre/Barbarian. Not enough to swing the final result in any meaningful way. The sheer amount of extra RnG the Root/Rotting Shaman has to deal with ends up costing them more mana and time in the long run compared to the JBB Shaman's simpler playstyle.

[bcbrown]

If root wears off, so what? Other scenario is face tanking anyway.