Your hopes for a 2.0 server?

[jinxy12]

Originally Posted by Infectious [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Pvp is fun, but it's what a new red server brings that I would vote no. Salty training the ec tunnel for months . Spamming ec tunnel auc channel for a red server.
Trolling rogean and crew.

These people deserve nothing and it's actually nice having them not here.

i get that your a fanboi for the gms but....

you think thats a red specific thing? green had people training ec tunnel its first week so idk what you're smoking.

if you're gonna be a yes man, least get the facts str8

[Infectious]

Originally Posted by jinxy12 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

i get that your a fanboi for the gms but....

you think thats a red specific thing? green had people training ec tunnel its first week so idk what you're smoking.

if you're gonna be a yes man, least get the facts str8

Ya. It was red players begging for a new server. Like they did on blue, years ago.

[loramin]

I think the chances of a new Green anytime soon are small, and the chances of a new Red even smaller.

That being said, as I've said many times before, if P99 is serious about being classic (and thus having a PvP option), that option needs to be teams. Any sort of individual PvP devolves into de-leveled epic-wielding twinks ganking newbies, and that just kills all interest in the server.

With teams, the PvPers have an incentive to go fight "the other team", or to defend the newbies of their team. It completely changes the alignment of incentives, towards a positive/healthy server.

Such a server will never be as popular as blue/green, but it could at least sustain a decent population, perpetually.

[pink grapefruit]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think the chances of a new Green anytime soon are small, and the chances of a new Red even smaller.

That being said, as I've said many times before, if P99 is serious about being classic (and thus having a PvP option), that option needs to be teams. Any sort of individual PvP devolves into de-leveled epic-wielding twinks ganking newbies, and that just kills all interest in the server.

With teams, the PvPers have an incentive to go fight "the other team", or to defend the newbies of their team. It completely changes the alignment of incentives, towards a positive/healthy server.

Such a server will never be as popular as blue/green, but it could at least sustain a decent population, perpetually.

The real fear with a teams server is that we end up with a Sullon Zek problem where one team dominates the server and the other team(s) don't get any raid content. Or depending on ruleset, having a Tallon Zek problem where crossteaming is so rampant it basically just becomes a FFA server with extra steps.

I believe any issues though would be basically resolved with timely fresh starts. All the red players have been wanting for many years now is a new server where everyone starts at level 1 again. If the server automatically rolled all their characters into blue at the end of the Velious timeline and started again, I think we would see a very healthy population regardless of ruleset.

Red players like to point out specific issues with the ruleset and blame that for the poor population, but what really killed the server is stagnation. Starting things over again on even footing would bring most people back, and again bring in some bluebie types to experience the chaos.

Anyway, thanks for your thoughtful reply. Idk why most bluebies get so mean whenever pvp is mentioned.

[Chewybunny]

Originally Posted by pink grapefruit [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The real fear with a teams server is that we end up with a Sullon Zek problem where one team dominates the server and the other team(s) don't get any raid content. Or depending on ruleset, having a Tallon Zek problem where crossteaming is so rampant it basically just becomes a FFA server with extra steps.

I believe any issues though would be basically resolved with timely fresh starts. All the red players have been wanting for many years now is a new server where everyone starts at level 1 again. If the server automatically rolled all their characters into blue at the end of the Velious timeline and started again, I think we would see a very healthy population regardless of ruleset.

Red players like to point out specific issues with the ruleset and blame that for the poor population, but what really killed the server is stagnation. Starting things over again on even footing would bring most people back, and again bring in some bluebie types to experience the chaos.

Anyway, thanks for your thoughtful reply. Idk why most bluebies get so mean whenever pvp is mentioned.

I played on Tallon from 2000-2004, crossteaming was largely focused on "Humans, Elves, Shorties" (Lighties) vs the evil team. And there was some cross-teaming guilds that had all of them. There were also some that were team specific. And from what I recall most were okay with pvping other "teams". So I don't recall cross-teaming being a major issue. It created a great dynamic in the game, and I remember my best EQ experiences on TZ.

[pink grapefruit]

Originally Posted by Chewybunny [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I played on Tallon from 2000-2004, crossteaming was largely focused on "Humans, Elves, Shorties" (Lighties) vs the evil team. And there was some cross-teaming guilds that had all of them. There were also some that were team specific. And from what I recall most were okay with pvping other "teams". So I don't recall cross-teaming being a major issue. It created a great dynamic in the game, and I remember my best EQ experiences on TZ.

Seems Pande never got the memo. Also ask the dark team guilds if they thought x-teaming was an issue lol.

I'm VZ, we were very similar but managed to do it better imo.

[Chewybunny]

Originally Posted by pink grapefruit [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Seems Pande never got the memo. Also ask the dark team guilds if they thought x-teaming was an issue lol.

I'm VZ, we were very similar but managed to do it better imo.

Yeah but everyone hated Pandemonium, and often were hostile to them.
I was on the Dark Team, my main was an Iksar Shaman. We had a lot of solidarity - a lot more than any other team.

[loramin]

Originally Posted by pink grapefruit [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The real fear with a teams server is that we end up with a Sullon Zek problem where one team dominates the server and the other team(s) don't get any raid content. Or depending on ruleset, having a Tallon Zek problem where crossteaming is so rampant it basically just becomes a FFA server with extra steps.

I believe any issues though would be basically resolved with timely fresh starts. All the red players have been wanting for many years now is a new server where everyone starts at level 1 again. If the server automatically rolled all their characters into blue at the end of the Velious timeline and started again, I think we would see a very healthy population regardless of ruleset.

Red players like to point out specific issues with the ruleset and blame that for the poor population, but what really killed the server is stagnation. Starting things over again on even footing would bring most people back, and again bring in some bluebie types to experience the chaos.

Anyway, thanks for your thoughtful reply. Idk why most bluebies get so mean whenever pvp is mentioned.

You're absolutely right that the team mechanics would need to be well-thought-out. Having rolling restarts is one approach, having a new take on teams and "territory" would be another, /guildwar is another, and there are probably other ways to approach it as well. Personally, I'm 100% agnostic to the approach.

I just think the underying system of "every man for himself" is fine for a game like Quake, but it doesn't work for a MMOG. You need a system that somehow promotes healthy PvP, not one that encourages griefers to grief off all the new folks.

Originally Posted by eqravenprince [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

What makes you say that? A new green is very much wanted and desired. They have the code. Release new green, worry about the merge from green 1.0 to blue later.

Because a new server is a lot of work for the staff, and so it would seem to require a lot of motivation on their part.

I'm not saying it will never happen, and I'd imagine that the the longer we go between servers, the more motivated they'll get (if only because they'll forget what a PITA Green 1.0 was for them [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.])

... but I just don't see signs of such motivation right now. I'd love to be wrong.

[pink grapefruit]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You're absolutely right that the team mechanics would need to be well-thought-out. Having rolling restarts is one approach, having a new take on teams and "territory" would be another, /guildwar is another, and there are probably other ways to approach it as well. Personally, I'm 100% agnostic to the approach.

I just think the underying system of "every man for himself" is fine for a game like Quake, but it doesn't work for a MMOG. You need a system that somehow promotes healthy PvP, not one that encourages griefers to grief off all the new folks.

oh i don't really disagree, and teams pvp is my jam bc that's what i did on live. and i don't know if anyone remember this, but back before there was talk of a discord server the devs were talking teams pvp. that was back when sirken was on staff.

as a very specific sort of eq nerd i would love it if someone would nerd out with me about potential teams pvp rulesets.

the most important thing imo is to ensure the teams mostly make sense from a RP standpoint. none of this "iksar and gnomes as one team" nonsense. really i think the SZ teams make the most sense, maybe with neutral team able to group (but not guild) with good and evil teams, and maybe let necros worship sol ro or something.

gonna stop myself before i spam everyone with a pointless dissertation on pvp rulesets lol

[TercerRigo]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

...that option needs to be teams. Any sort of individual PvP devolves into de-leveled epic-wielding twinks ganking newbies, and that just kills all interest in the server.

With teams, the PvPers have an incentive to go fight "the other team", or to defend the newbies of their team. It completely changes the alignment of incentives, towards a positive/healthy server.

Such a server will never be as popular as blue/green, but it could at least sustain a decent population, perpetually.

I would very much like to play this.