AC/HP question (Ranger)

[Snaggles]

If a ranger can tank slowed blue cons with torp it can do a great job. Likewise if it can peel and tank a red con for 20 seconds it did its job.

Mine usually runs around with around 200MR and 2200 hps. I mainly just try to max MR with GMR with max Str using Focus. I have a few Hp items to swap out if I’m having to tank for small group stuff but it’s not preferred. I’m sure with better gear that would change…to a degree.

[Ripqozko]

Originally Posted by Snaggles [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If a ranger can tank slowed blue cons with torp it can do a great job. Likewise if it can peel and tank a red con for 20 seconds it did its job.

Mine usually runs around with around 200MR and 2200 hps. I mainly just try to max MR with GMR with max Str using Focus. I have a few Hp items to swap out if I’m having to tank for small group stuff but it’s not preferred. I’m sure with better gear that would change…to a degree.

Gear does make a difference I buff to 4.9k hp and there is def better geared then me.

[Snaggles]

Originally Posted by Ripqozko [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Gear does make a difference I buff to 4.9k hp and there is def better geared then me.

Yea for sure. I top out at about 4k. I’d take another 1k in a heart-beat and will slowly work on adding raid gear. Most the EC buys trade hps for MR so it’s a lateral move unless I’m swapping depending on the fight.

I guess that’s the reality though. The better your stuff the less bag slots you need filled. BiS or at least top tier is loaded with hps, ac, and other stats. In the low or mid game you have to pick a path or carry a lot of extra junk.

[Ripqozko]

Originally Posted by Snaggles [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yea for sure. I top out at about 4k. I’d take another 1k in a heart-beat and will slowly work on adding raid gear. Most the EC buys trade hps for MR so it’s a lateral move unless I’m swapping depending on the fight.

I guess that’s the reality though. The better your stuff the less bag slots you need filled. BiS or at least top tier is loaded with hps, ac, and other stats. In the low or mid game you have to pick a path or carry a lot of extra junk.

Yup, I could take more hp if I reduced resi since I normally wear MR ring and ring 9 I'm losing like 80 hp there but not being in VQ, riot limits that, my belt also is bad. Rangers Def can break 5k easy. Even I can with gear swaps.

[Duik]

Just call it Warder Under Da Bridge.

[Solist]

Yeah there is a lot of people who haven’t parsed posting nonsense.

Go get on a 1350 displayed AC ranger and do 4 hours of seb in the same camp. Do the same on a 1000ac displayed ranger or just take a bunch of gear off like vulak boots/doze ear/dagarn legs (as I was so focused on AC…).They take identical damage.

I’ve repeated this on a half dozen different mobs and levels. Cliff golems, protector of zek, paebala warrior, all the usual “high ish” mobs. Raid content is laughably bad. In general xp and slightly harder than XP content a 1100ac monk takes 30% less damage than a 1350ac ranger (or thereabouts). The class is broken.

Shamans with identical AC take 15 or 20% less damage than rangers give or take.

Now if you stack HP and MR. You’re amazing still. VP, Fear, Zland? All solid options you can be effective without outright just being a bump. Think I run around 340-345ish MR maxed out so I can take a tash, and have blue flower dispelled and still cap (for fear)… but man why bother, get on a better class and be useful.

[Jimjam]

Originally Posted by Solist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Shamans with identical AC take 15 or 20% less damage than rangers give or take.

This is the point that has really piqued my interest. Are you comparing average damage per hit (mitigation) or overall damage (including avoidance)?

I would have thought the avoidance benefit of +20 defence would have really shifted things in to the ranger’s benefit.

Perhaps this is actually part of the explanation. Say both ranger and shaman display 1000 AC. A larger portion of the ranger’s displayed AC is avoidance, meaning they have less remaining displayed ac to represent mitigation. Furthermore, perhaps the shaman is using more buff AC than the ranger, which is more effective than worn AC? Oh, or the shaman’s shield ac is going uncapped/double counted (i don’t believe either of those mechanics are classic).

I’ve noticed many rangers don’t bother with their thorncoat line of buffs, even though it represents a large portion of their mitigation.


Okay, no longer discussing the quote and on to something else. From what I understand melee/priests used a similar AC calculator in velious and should have equivalent worn AC hardcaps. Only silk casters had a different equation. If we can control for buff ac rangers should be mitigating similarly / better than a shaman off their worn ac late velious (depending on whether the +20 defence is in or not).

What am I missing? Is there something needing dev attention?

[Jimjam]

Originally Posted by Solist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yeah there is a lot of people who haven’t parsed posting nonsense.

Go get on a 1350 displayed AC ranger and do 4 hours of seb in the same camp. Do the same on a 1000ac displayed ranger or just take a bunch of gear off like vulak boots/doze ear/dagarn legs (as I was so focused on AC…).They take identical damage.

A 1000 AC displayed ranger may well be at the supposed 289 worn AC hardcap, depending on how neglected their AGi is. Even taking off a bunch of gear the Vulak ranger will be way over hardcap. Given this it makes sense that a 1350AC ranger wouldn't mitigate any better. Further more, I imagine these mobs attack values are swamped by AC close to the 'hardcap' anyway. Most of EQ's mobs (outside of expansion raiding) were balanced around banded armour tier AC, right?

[Solist]

Not all silk casters, on p99, get the same returns for AC.

This isn't everquest. This is an emulator of the memory some guy has of everquest

[Jimjam]

For anyone interested in how AC supposedly did work in classic (so should work here) there are quite a few threads.

I posted the apparent Velious caps here citing this thread as reference.

For future searches:

 

Worn ac hard cap

worn ac soft cap

The post in this thread suggesting shaman takes less damage than ranger indicates the OP of this thread may have the source closest to what p99 is running on.

Looks like worn AC should be hardcapped in Velious. No returns after cap at all. That said, the AC you get from class / skill / buff bonuses added to that hard capped worn ac was soft capped for melee with a fairly small return (other classes had a hard cap on these too).

I aim for 289 worn ac on my toons cos I'm not a cheat [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]