Enchanters didn't charm until PoP dire charm AA

[starkind]

Yep nerf monks, nerf chanters. Gg.

[Jimjam]

Originally Posted by starkind [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yep nerf monks, nerf chanters. Gg.

Mob attack values are too low. Or maybe the by level worn AC caps are too high. Either way, they should be rolling higher damage against silk tier armour. It's been far too easy to mitigate damage on my 'soft' alts.

I know the staff adjusted the AC system previously - and that was a good step - but it still doesn't feel quite right.

[starkind]

Originally Posted by cd288 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The only actual evidence that has been provided is about channeling. The other “evidence” are random player posts from 20+ years ago that are contradicted by other player posts and guides (including one in era player written guide that calls Charm the most powerful spell enchanters have and details how to charm solo). Honestly the biggest difference is simply technology; the game was very laggy unless you had a great computer (which most people didnt) and Internet disconnects were extremely frequent (btw the latter helped to influence the “camping” meta that arose because groups didn’t want to move through a dungeon and have people go LD).

Btw where’s that treatise you told all of us you were writing with actual evidence that was gonna prove how charm isn’t classic? Lol loser

Originally Posted by starkind [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

99% of us know what random posts were accurate and don't care how easy the game is. So we know it was harder and that it took full groups to reliably do anything outside of killing greens in the open sky world.

Originally Posted by Jimjam [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Mob attack values are too low. Or maybe the by level worn AC caps are too high. Either way, they should be rolling higher damage against silk tier armour. It's been far too easy to mitigate damage on my 'soft' alts.

I know the staff adjusted the AC system previously - and that was a good step - but it still doesn't feel quite right.

Yeah, my wizard couldn't tank anything higher than lvl 20 on live even with twink ac and agi.

It was definitely a step in the right direction.

Don't forget melee survivability came a lot from dodge, block, parry, riposte. Those skills are all renormalized towards pop progression.

Rogues should be getting hit harder and have the potential to dodge, post, parry 6 attacks in a row and get a bind wound off, it was a tricky feat, but seen it done in VANILLA, first hand at lvl 35 is. Probably 34. Vs aviaks, it was a big brag with screenshots and everything.

Mobs should hit for max/ high dmg way more and land hits way more often, and dodge, parry, riposte should come into play with way more.

Making it really hard to survive a lvl 40 mob agro on clothies. That and certain mobs should have higher mr.

Fast cast root at high lvl 1.5 seconds vs the standard 2.0 seconds exists for a reason.

[starkind]

I pretty much remember having to strafe run and maybe get a lucky dodge to reroot reliably out of doors was way more popular. Or keep mobs at max distance, and reroot after back peddling, verant had root nuking very highly tuned so that dark blues could sometimes getchu, especially with a bit of lag and a resist. Which was way more common.

[Clazxiss]

Even though I've been out of the game for a year, I couldn't resist responding to this thread. First and foremost, I believe enchanters are functioning as they truly were intended to function. The enchanter was my main character for the entire time I played live. Was charm unreliable, even with high charisma? Yes. Were there "creative" ways to work around this issue, yes. But ask yourselves this question about the charm spells, was it a true intention from the Verant team for them to be innately unreliable? I suspect this was not the case!

Thanks to the efforts of Nilbog, Rogean, and the P99 crew, I feel this version of EQ is a more balanced game than what live was in terms of spell behavior. Even the lull line of spells can be dependable, which they weren't on live. And why this is, I have my suspicions, but I'll say one name, Absor.

This is a man who was supposed to be the liaison between Verant and the community. Below is an except from a thread about the nasty enchanter charm nerf during PoP. It details how he supposedly came to the conclusion of what the charm nerf should.

Poster: Cantatus
"And then despite all the rants on our boards about Sony completing ignoring other concerns of ours while continually bashing us with the nerfbat as if we were in a game of Whack-A-Mole the Charm nerf was handled the exact same way. Did the pleading of them discussing the changes with us like they did in the case of Manaburn to Wizards and mitigation changes to Monks gain us the same curtousy? No. All we got was Absor telling us that they had been working closely with 5 Enchanters on Test to ensure the CoD changes weren't too horrible. Apparently those 5 Enchanters speak the gospel truth despite the fact that not only tons of Enchanters think the nerf was overdone but also several other classes."

Original thread here: https://thedruidsgrove.org/archive/eq/t-628.html

So that might be it. 5 Enchanters who play on the test server may have decided what the nerf would be for the rest of the population. That is textbook asinine by today's standards of MMORPG testing. Absor is the same man that argued "druids are fine" as they dominated each expansion in terms of solo ability while also being able to offer group utility. I suspect the coding for enchanter charm was gimped from launch on live and no one on the Verant team took the time to correct it. Couple that with Absor's ability to turn cheek on non druid classes and you have the reason why charm was unreliable.

I'm keeping my tin foil hat on for this. I believe I'm right!

[indiscriminate_hater]

feels over reals

[Snortles ban appeal]

root nuke def consistently broke as a live wiz

[RecondoJoe]

I notice the root thing too

I think Snare / DoT was way more common, particularly for druids

[loramin]

Originally Posted by RecondoJoe [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I notice the root thing too

I think Snare / DoT was way more common, particularly for druids

Well, in the early days snared/DoTed mobs didn't lose 33.3% of their DoT's damage, so snaring + DoTing was the best way to level as a Druid ... because the rules worked differently.

But that stopped in '99 https://wiki.project1999.com/Patch_N...ber_13.2C_1999 (and, seeing as how it was in the patch notes, pretty much every Druid knew about the change instantly). From that point on root/rot became the de facto Druid soloing technique, with quadding and charming being risky but potentially more lucrative approaches.

But again ... if it was as easy to charm on live as it was here, basic logic dictates a hell of a lot more Druids would have charmed ... instead of it what everyone remembers it being on live: a relatively niche, high risk technique.

[beargryllz]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Well, in the early days snared/DoTed mobs didn't lose 33.3% of their DoT's damage, so snaring + DoTing was the best way to level as a Druid ... because the rules worked differently.

But that stopped in '99 https://wiki.project1999.com/Patch_N...ber_13.2C_1999 (and, seeing as how it was in the patch notes, pretty much every Druid knew about the change instantly). From that point on root/rot became the de facto Druid soloing technique, with quadding and charming being risky but potentially more lucrative approaches.

But again ... if it was as easy to charm on live as it was here, basic logic dictates a hell of a lot more Druids would have charmed ... instead of it what everyone remembers it being on live: a relatively niche, high risk technique.

High risk in 1999 meant "oh god if I go any deeper and attempt to break this room, I might *never* get this corpse back. I certainly don't know any clerics that can rez me even if I could find it..."

There is no high risk now. Pull the entire bar in Unrest and if we die, there are 18 clerics camped out on backup accounts ready to log in and fix us up. Free buffs too