Spells: Enchanter Mesmerize does mem wipe too frequently

[azxten]

Originally Posted by xmaerx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Mez does blur very often. It's definitely not 100%. Probably closer to 60 or 70%. Actual blur spells, however, blur more often.

https://wiki.project1999.com/Memory_Blur

Whatever that modifier is gets adjusted significantly. If mesmerize is a 1% chance and works 60% of the time, a 10% chance might work.. 66% of the time. Or perhaps it fails a tenth as often. Perhaps there are calculations taking place that are not immediately obvious. Perhaps there's no perhaps involved, and enchanters have known this for some time.

It's definitely *not* a 10% chance. Nor is Blanket of Forgetfulness a 20% chance.

https://wiki.project1999.com/Blanket_of_Forgetfulness

In fact, I'd go so far as to say that Blanket might apply its blur chance twice by that descriptor, which is why I've had it fail *MAYBE* once, ever.

All blurs are performing well beyond the listed percentage.

Furthermore the blur on Mesmerize might be powerful, but that is often a DOWNSIDE also. Spamming mez to interrupt or lock things down while soloing, for example, can give mobs health ticks. It also doesn't blur mobs that are immune to mez, as far as I can tell.

Memblurs are also beneficial spells. Not hostile. They do not resist, and are significantly more useful as a result.

No, I don't need proof, because I'm right, and so is the server config for memblurs. Evidence from the past likely doesn't realize that the "blur" effect is significantly more noticeable on pacified or far away mobs. The "Higher level less effective" commentary is likely a symptom of larger aggro ranges, or closer quarters.

EDIT: If you want to know the real reason enchanters are batshit broken, see: the exploit known as GCD resetting.

Doesn't explain the nerf to mez blur that was mentioned or the past thread finding the same that blur chance is too high. Plenty of people talked about mobs walking away and using the blur on mez. It appears these mechanics were well known during classic era and they were nerfed and complained about as well. This is more evidence to counter the "people didn't know how to play" narrative.

I suggest reading some of these old Enchanter posts to find out what live was really like in classic. Like I already said, multiple people mentioning they didn't even mem Mesmerize because it was so unreliable due to bugs and difficult to survive getting aggro.

All of the evidence points to a vastly different Enchanter game on live vs P99 but the same tired arguments keep being rolled out about people complaining to get their class buffed, they didn't know how to play, no one knew what CHA did, no one knew how their spells worked. No.

It's really interesting to even see mentions that high level Enchanters basically did nothing on raids except cast buffs. It is mentioned they couldn't charm or mez anything in planes. Probably due to the same combination of bugs and aggro.

I still say channeling is one of the biggest reasons aggro is shrugged off by P99 Enchanters. Starting at level 1 you can easily cast in combat even with multiple mobs. Nothing even close to this happened in live. The flip side is the already proven fact that charm was so buggy it was never used. The mentions of LOS bugs with Mez. The widely known problems with pets falling through floors, etc. Channeling and charm are both proven to have been different in live. There are bug report threads already.

Chanters were a group only class. They didn't solo. They were buff bots in raids and didn't have charmed planar mobs fighting for them.

Just the thought that Brad "The Vision" McQuaid would have released classic planes and watched Enchanters charming those mobs burning everything down and easily recharming is ridiculous. This never happened and it was never even close to possibly happening.

[xmaerx]

Originally Posted by azxten [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I suggest reading some of these old Enchanter posts to find out what live was really like in classic. Like I already said, multiple people mentioning they didn't even mem Mesmerize because it was so unreliable due to bugs and difficult to survive getting aggro.

Where did you prove this? Because I think you're confused.

Also the "Blur doesn't work on subsequent casts of mez" is likely a critical misunderstanding. They likely don't realize mobs can't change their targets while mez'd. The main method of testing if something is blurred is to /assist it, and that just doesn't cut it.

[Gustoo]

Man it would be funny if enchanters were always hyper OP and people just sucked so bad. Lets hop in a time machine and win everquest. Thats what we would do with a time machine right?

Does using a clicky to reset cooldown only impact your bottom slot spell? or all?

I think thats a classic mechanic though.

[xmaerx]

Originally Posted by Gustoo [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Man it would be funny if enchanters were always hyper OP and people just sucked so bad. Lets hop in a time machine and win everquest. Thats what we would do with a time machine right?

Does using a clicky to reset cooldown only impact your bottom slot spell? or all?

I think thats a classic mechanic though.

It impacts every slot to wipe the 2s Global Cooldown, and *reduces* the recast of the top slot by ~2 seconds, as well as wiping the global cooldown. If it weren't for that, recapturing a hasted charm pet would be 10 times harder. Locking down several mobs would require longer duration mez. Casting several level 4 mez's to blur something would take 10 times as long, especially with resists included. Hell, even buffing the raid would take exponentially longer, and cost you a lot more mana ticks from sitting down.

GCD resets may have been classic, but they were not readily available, and were likely not standard. You basically needed jboots inventory slotted or a spyglass, since they put a "short cast time" on the rod of insidious glamour that is not present on P99.

If this GCD resetting was common practice, there would be commentary on the only reasonable option for doing so, from Zam. https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=6166

This gives enchanters cheap, easy access to one of the best gdc resets in the game which can be abused right out of the gate.

[Danth]

Originally Posted by xmaerx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If this GCD resetting was common practice, there would be commentary on the only reasonable option for doing so, from Zam. https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=6166

While they don't mention it on the telescope, people do discuss cooldown resetting in relation to the earring that drops off Grachnist. While not the majority, enough players knew of that trick that I wouldn't classify it as "rare." I saw folks doing it once in awhile. To a degree players were scared of talking about "powerful tricks" as openly as we do here on P1999 out of fear of Verant nerfing them.

If Daldaen is right--I can't say, I did not play an Enchanter, then or now--it might explain the difference we see. Mez might blur quite a bit, but if it only does it on an initial cast, not on refreshes, then more and more aggro would be piling up.

Speaking of nerfs, P1999 does not appear to replicate the "Great Lull Nerf" that lasted from early Classic until mid-Luclin at least, or whenever the lull line was revamped. Those spells were nerfed host-side, not client side, so it doesn't show up in the spelldata files used by P99 as a basis for its spell information. Can't say I mind, my Paladin enjoys having a reliable means of splitting and it could be argued the spells were "broken" since a spell that can't be effectively used for its designed purpose is hardly working correctly.

Danth

[Vivitron]

Originally Posted by xmaerx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

since they put a "short cast time" on the rod of insidious glamour that is not present on P99.

I think it is present on p99. The reason I think so is because if you move while spamming rod clicks some of the clicks get interrupted, but I never noticed interrupts on my jboots.

[Sun Feb 07 12:24:24 2021] You begin casting Alliance.
[Sun Feb 07 12:24:24 2021] You feel quite amicable.
[Sun Feb 07 12:24:24 2021] You begin casting Alliance.
[Sun Feb 07 12:24:24 2021] You feel quite amicable.
[Sun Feb 07 12:24:25 2021] You begin casting Alliance.
[Sun Feb 07 12:24:25 2021] Your spell is interrupted.
[Sun Feb 07 12:24:25 2021] You begin casting Alliance.
[Sun Feb 07 12:24:25 2021] Your spell is interrupted.
[Sun Feb 07 12:24:26 2021] You begin casting Alliance.
[Sun Feb 07 12:24:26 2021] You feel quite amicable.

[xmaerx]

Originally Posted by Vivitron [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think it is present on p99. The reason I think so is because if you move while spamming rod clicks some of the clicks get interrupted, but I never noticed interrupts on my jboots.

[Sun Feb 07 12:24:24 2021] You begin casting Alliance.
[Sun Feb 07 12:24:24 2021] You feel quite amicable.
[Sun Feb 07 12:24:24 2021] You begin casting Alliance.
[Sun Feb 07 12:24:24 2021] You feel quite amicable.
[Sun Feb 07 12:24:25 2021] You begin casting Alliance.
[Sun Feb 07 12:24:25 2021] Your spell is interrupted.
[Sun Feb 07 12:24:25 2021] You begin casting Alliance.
[Sun Feb 07 12:24:25 2021] Your spell is interrupted.
[Sun Feb 07 12:24:26 2021] You begin casting Alliance.
[Sun Feb 07 12:24:26 2021] You feel quite amicable.

Yes, but the "small cast time" was to prevent spam casting it on other people. Whatever the cast time is on P99 doesn't seem to solve that problem, and was likely a guess meant to preserve its function as a GCD reset.

As for the Grim Aura clicky, it does seem like it was "relatively known" by mid Velious. Still attesting that it is more of a power boost for Enchanter than any other class in the game, and what pushes us into "broken" territory.

[DMN]

There were really three key things that happened in the first year. Clarity was added to the class, tash was made unreistable, and GCD reset gained more wide spread use. Tangentially but also importantly, a lot more gamers started getting cable internet. I remember personally going from 500-600 ping at prime time down to 100-150. Massive difference for enchanter.

[MaCtastic]

Mez does not blur at 100%. Proof, just had a mob in ally with not blur after mezz if it 17 times in a row. The. Raptured and it worked.

[DMN]

That's because it was a higher level mob most likely, unlike the OP and the pathetic level 20ish goblin he was mezing, which, just like classic, tend to blur quite easily.