Raiding proposal - Level the playing field

[rubicaant]

Plus camping out for 16 hours for one mob is less fun than logging on and slaying 5 in one night. But that's just me [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[condap99]

Originally Posted by rubicaant [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Most casual raiders don't want to login at 2am to get targets. More timely Quakes solves that and allows folks to stay with their chosen community.

So don't log in for targets outside of your playtime? Or be ok with being in a guild that doesn't compete for competitive targets?

Originally Posted by rubicaant [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Plus camping out for 16 hours for one mob is less fun than logging on and slaying 5 in one night. But that's just me [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You're wasting your time if your solution includes GMs quaking more often or implementing a code change like respawn all of north if vulak pops. We literally had GMs tell us that they were going to quake it 2x a month. Like 8 months into it, we learned that instead of coding it to happen randomly, it relied on them manually hitting a button. And ofcourse, like any manual process, it fizzled out.

[xdrcfrx]

Originally Posted by condap99 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

So don't log in for targets outside of your playtime? Or be ok with being in a guild that doesn't compete for competitive targets?

This same rationale could be applied to complaints from the FRAG and Riot about timer's being spread out, couldn't it? So just don't contest every single spawn, at all hours of the day?

This is a game, after all. People make friends, and prefer not to have to leave the communities they are part of in order to experience the various content the game has to offer. Taking it so seriously that you're unwilling to share anything, ever, is part of the problem. Competition is fun, but it's only one of several ingredients that make p99 enjoyable. Serpentine draft was meant to address this point, but seal team (surely acting alone, and not at all coordinated with anyone else on blue I'm sure) probably going to see to it that it falls apart. So we're back to square zero.

Originally Posted by condap99 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You're wasting your time if your solution includes GMs quaking more often or implementing a code change like respawn all of north if vulak pops. We literally had GMs tell us that they were going to quake it 2x a month. Like 8 months into it, we learned that instead of coding it to happen randomly, it relied on them manually hitting a button. And ofcourse, like any manual process, it fizzled out.

I think this conversation is mostly a speculative "wouldn't it be nice, if..." kind of a thing. I doubt anyone really expects those kinds of changes to be made. It's still worth the thought experiment of talking through the ideas though, if just to see whether or not you can forecast out the strengths and weaknesses.

[condap99]

Originally Posted by xdrcfrx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This same rationale could be applied to complaints from the FRAG and Riot about timer's being spread out, couldn't it? So just don't contest every single spawn, at all hours of the day?

This is a game, after all. People make friends, and prefer not to have to leave the communities they are part of in order to experience the various content the game has to offer. Taking it so seriously that you're unwilling to share anything, ever, is part of the problem. Competition is fun, but it's only one of several ingredients that make p99 enjoyable. Serpentine draft was meant to address this point, but seal team (surely acting alone, and not at all coordinated with anyone else on blue I'm sure) probably going to see to it that it falls apart. So we're back to square zero.

No. The same logic couldn't be applied. Because you just lifted the scope of the conversation from the individual player, to an entire raiding entity.

Individual players choose when to log in or not log in.

Raiding entities have players globally, and are specifically designed to support 24/7 coverage. They will never stop contesting targets because that's not how a random dude on the forums thinks the game should be played.

It's extremely simple. "People make friends, and prefer not to have to leave the communities they are part of in order to experience the various content the game has to offer." This is the tradeoff that you have to consider. Stay with the guilds that don't care enough about raiding to have the infrastructure to win competitively because you like them or know them irl or whatever... or join the raiding entities that do care about winning, and have the infrastructure in place to do it.

That's your choice. There's no wrong answer. But the rules won't be changed so that you don't have to make the choice. Live with your decisions and stop complaining about how the system isn't fair.

[xdrcfrx]

Originally Posted by condap99 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

No. The same logic couldn't be applied. Because you just lifted the scope of the conversation from the individual player, to an entire raiding entity.

Individual players choose when to log in or not log in.

Raiding entities have players globally, and are specifically designed to support 24/7 coverage. They will never stop contesting targets because that's not how a random dude on the forums thinks the game should be played.

It's extremely simple. "People make friends, and prefer not to have to leave the communities they are part of in order to experience the various content the game has to offer." This is the tradeoff that you have to consider. Stay with the guilds that don't care enough about raiding to have the infrastructure to win competitively because you like them or know them irl or whatever... or join the raiding entities that do care about winning, and have the infrastructure in place to do it.

That's your choice. There's no wrong answer. But the rules won't be changed so that you don't have to make the choice. Live with your decisions and stop complaining about how the system isn't fair.

Well shame on me for discussing the topic of the thread, I guess. More quakes would be good, both as a means of allowing more people to experience the content and as a tool to keep respawn timers relatively stacked up. A serpent draft 4 times a year is good, and is not an onerous burden on anyone. IMO a CT-in-fear type mechanic for with Vulak in ToV would alleviate a lot of the angst that lies at the root of the near constant petitionquest that goes along with the raiding environment on p99 blue. Those were the the points of discussion, none is a complaint about the fairness of the system. You'll recognize that elsewhere I acknowledge the server is a baseline FFA environment, and that aspect is 100% part of what makes p99 attractive.

Get over yourself.

[zodium]

Originally Posted by condap99 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You're wasting your time if your solution includes GMs quaking more often or implementing a code change like respawn all of north if vulak pops. We literally had GMs tell us that they were going to quake it 2x a month. Like 8 months into it, we learned that instead of coding it to happen randomly, it relied on them manually hitting a button. And ofcourse, like any manual process, it fizzled out.

it's well known that two quakes a month, distributed as a random chance per day rather than the old system, would solve like 50% of raiding scene problems. however, a lot of eqemu code is presumably still glued together from random candy letters lethalencounter found in his couch circa 2003. in conclusion: lol. and also, lmao.

[rubicaant]

Yea I don't think the coding changes to NToV would ever happen, and frequent quakes may be a pipe dream, but definitely feasible.

[Foxplay]

Quakes are best for smaller guilds, as well as the ultra competitive. Since it's impossible to kill everything and be everywhere at once smaller guilds will get a target or two on a quake (provided they try and don't go for a priority 1 target)

It's good for the competitive guilds too because it has all of them playing the game instead of just the 16hr yellow text warriors

[Croco]

the staff don't care anymore, we barely get quakes and haven't had a holiday exp increase in about a year and a half

[Fammaden]

Originally Posted by rubicaant [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

And some could argue that this proposal is more classic-like than our current iteration. We had almost weekly repops for years on live.

Its absolutely more classic, anyone old enough to have raided back then remembers the frequent server maintenance downtime. Difference being that it would occur during west coast business hours when the devs were at work, so like 1PM EST on a random ass Tuesday they bring down the servers and the uber guilds scramble to be in place to log in for AoW or whatever.

Not nearly as many people could work from home back then. The raid scene was run by college students, with a healthy contingent of unemployed, shift workers, ten on/ten off schedules, etc. Raid guilds had a lot of housewife and deployed military representation in the roster.

Originally Posted by Croco [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

the staff don't care anymore, we barely get quakes and haven't had a holiday exp increase in about a year and a half

Pretty sure there was a quote from Rog at green launch that he didn't want to do special xp bonuses with a fresh server, and we've been seeing the absence of them ever since.