SK and paladin, which one do you honestly think is better

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by greatdane [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Doesn't matter, resisted spells still generate aggro and it's not like pala spells aren't resisted the same. At least SK has some spells with negative resist check if that was a concern. And 55+ mobs are outright immune to stun... do stuns even generate aggro when the mob is immune? I can't remember.

WHen it comes to off tanking in raids it's actually great to be able to get snap aggro and then feign it off after a while to hand the mob to a warrior if needed. Flurry drakes come to mind.



Fear kiting is way more mana efficient than facetanking mobs and healing yourself afterwards. 45+ pala can use clickies to heal for free but that takes forever and SK can fear kite for free with clickies. I can't think of anything that's immune to magic and fear that a pala would be able to solo anyway.

When it comes to offtanking in raids, I was more referring to the idea that Paladins can heal themselves and generate agro via their spells, whereas Shadowknights can really only generate agro, due to resists. From my experience, spells like lifetap are mostly resisted on raid mobs, even with the -200 check. Lifetaps are gimped in the raid scene on this server, to prevent cheesing bosses. I do agree that SKs have better snap agro, so that is a very good point in favor if SKs in raids, and FD is always nice[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I also agree fear kiting is overall better than a Paladin's toolkit, barring some specific scenarios. It is more mana efficient, and you can do it for free forever. SKs get their full kit (snare, fear, FD) in clickie form, whereas a Paladin needs to cast their roots and stuns, they only get soothe on clickie. Any mob above 55 is also immune to fear, so Paladins could go toe to toe with a 55+ mob with more options than an SK. If you want the be the type of player than does solo challenges, Paladin can handle some mobs better. Cliff Golems come to mind here. They are level 58 and summon, so your only real option is to facetank with a willsapper. A Paladin would be much better in that fight with heals.

[Ennewi]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I also agree fear kiting is overall better than a Paladin's toolkit, barring some specific scenarios. It is more mana efficient, and you can do it for free forever. SKs get their full kit (snare, fear, FD) in clickie form, whereas a Paladin needs to cast their roots and stuns, they only get soothe on clickie. Any mob above 55 is also immune to fear, so Paladins could go toe to toe with a 55+ mob with more options than an SK. If you want the be the type of player than does solo challenges, Paladin can handle some mobs better. Cliff Golems come to mind here. They are level 58 and summon, so your only real option is to facetank with a willsapper. A Paladin would be much better in that fight with heals.

https://wiki.project1999.com/Deepwater_Bracer

[greatdane]

Originally Posted by Ennewi [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

https://wiki.project1999.com/Deepwater_Bracer

Stun on a 6.0 cast time is borderline worthless tbh.

[White_knight]

Originally Posted by greatdane [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Fear kiting is way more mana efficient than facetanking mobs and healing yourself afterwards. 45+ pala can use clickies to heal for free but that takes forever and SK can fear kite for free with clickies. I can't think of anything that's immune to magic and fear that a pala would be able to solo anyway.

Using DW helm and arms I was going 60-90mins on solo's sessions without bum hitting the deck. The HoT heal has been a game changer and I was grinding Velks fairly easy.

Depends how you play.

Also yes, fear kiting is good in outdoor zones, but limited in dungeons where the gud xp/named can be found.

I.e my goal for my Paladin to hit 60 with his remaining 80pct is 20pct in Kedge, 20Pct in Sebilis and 20pct in HS, and 20pct (secret zone).

Basically all zones SKs would struggle to solo due to mechanics of fearing and needing space.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by White_knight [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Using DW helm and arms I was going 60-90mins on solo's sessions without bum hitting the deck. The HoT heal has been a game changer and I was grinding Velks fairly easy.

Depends how you play.

Also yes, fear kiting is good in outdoor zones, but limited in dungeons where the gud xp/named can be found.

I.e my goal for my Paladin to hit 60 with his remaining 80pct is 20pct in Kedge, 20Pct in Sebilis and 20pct in HS, and 20pct (secret zone).

Basically all zones SKs would struggle to solo due to mechanics of fearing and needing space.

Fear kiting is not limited in dungeons at all. You just use a high level snare with a short duration fear. Once you learn a dungeon you can find the safe areas to pull to, and you can fear kite there. With FD you have plenty of opportunities to learn the dungeon too.

I do stand corrected on the no clickie stun, forgot about the bracer. Clickie stun is very nice. Even with a 6 second cast time, no recast is very OP since stuns generally have a decent cooldown.

[Ennewi]

Originally Posted by greatdane [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Stun on a 6.0 cast time is borderline worthless tbh.

It's pretty good for holding aggro when manadrained / when there's no mana regen, just has to be spammed early and/or used in tandem with flash of light, similar to BE gauntlets and disease cloud. And if two players click theirs in succession, continuous stunlock. As mentioned, no recast time. BE greaves are great for that reason too, at least before Death Peace, but even then they still have value for dragging corpses and dropping trains. Again, knights are dependent on mana regen / vulnerable to manadrain so anything that still allows them to function as casters goes a long way.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Although, a Shadowknight could in theory kite a mob indefinately, with their pet attacking the mob from behind. Similar to this video I made of killing an Ice Burrower https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=5fsvt1xfuqY , a Shadowknight could keep agro by chain casting https://wiki.project1999.com/Blood_Ember_Gauntlets , and keeping distance with JBoots or SoW pots. That means a Shadowknight can kill magic immune targets with enough time and kiting space. Would take forever, but it would be doable.

EDIT: Duh, they could just use disease cloud as well to keep agro. The spell cost is 5, so it is basically free if you have Flowing Thought I and II. Wouldn't be doable on summoning mobs sadly.

[Arvan]

Better at what? They both have strength/weakness in different situations.

[Keebz]

Paladins have some cool niches, but in aggregate I'd say SK is stronger.

[White_knight]

Both have their strs and -strs.

Question is very broad tbh.

But here:

SK have alot if nice tools, both invs, Levi, FD, pet, summon corpse, fear kiting, pacify undead etc.

Paladin have, pacify, heals, stuns, HP buffs, rez.

For solo:

Overall: nil difference both can go 1-60, just depends on your style of play.

Outdoors:
Shadowknight
Indoors:
Paladin

For dps:
Shadowknight

For raid:
Paladin, though 100pct can be argued SK can help pull.

For full group xp:
Paladin, though the difference is basically nothing, extra heals and LoH tips this in the Paladins favor.

For duo's:
Shadowknight, the extra dps, FD, etc helps more.

Summary:
As a Paladin lover I advise people to play SK because it serves people's need to feel like a DPS, and they have FD.
Paladin isn't for everyone, it's a slower, controlled leveling experience and your end game is something that most won't enjoy. However, in the long run a geared Paladin will out solo a geared Shadowknight. I.e, Paladins can solo Crypt.

This is why there's 1000 Shadowknights to 1 Paladin on blue.

Both are great, just slightly different approaches.

P.s. a Paladin + Shaman duo is great fun.