Why did the Kael FTE rules change?

[Dman2701]

Please show fraps of me training anyone, because it sure wasn't me.
But I have lots and lots of fraps of you guys training well everyone over the weekend

[Twochain]

Originally Posted by Fammaden [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

but at the same time you have to wonder if there's an ulterior motive since I assume they believe they have all the best racers/FTE'rs in Freedom.

This is a fair point, as you're correct that I believe Freedom has the best Racers/FTErs. I'd go as far as to say that most other guilds believe the same thing. Two things about that though.

1. Racing in ToV is much more of a crapshoot than racing in Kael. Sometimes, when racing for a far target, such as koi/ladym/vulak/trips/twins, being clearly ahead of everyone else isn't necessarily a good thing. Watching old FTE videos, there were plenty, if not a majority of the time where the person who won FTE was in 2nd/3rd most of the race. It's all fun and games until DA wears off and you get one rounded. Racing in ToV is as much about not being killed on the way up as it is being the fastest.

2. Racing guarantees you a chance at killing the mob. But it does not guarantee that you kill it. If we win a Vulak FTE at 5am, and can't muster the people to get it down in 2 hours, we don't get the mob. As is, if Vulak spawns at 5am, Riot is getting the mob, virtually 0 chance it's being killed by anyone else.

The bottom line is, I could have 60 of the best raiders this server ever had, all in best in slot or near best in slot gear. (Hypothetically speaking) Yet we would still have 0 chance at killing Vulak, unless we either got trained and they conceded... or pulled off a miracle. This is not classic nor is it competitive. What's the minimum number of people a guild needs to kill Vulak in a competitive environment? Too damn high is the answer. Before rooted dragons, the number was 40-50.


To expand on to Conda's points, I very much understand why Rog rooted them. Sirken was forced out, Braknar ninja posted a thread about how ToV was on a permanent rotation because he very quickly learned how annoying it was to deal with 30 fraps an ordeal, with two sides vehemently declaring that the other side is 100% at fault. (This is all assumption) Then Braknar quit the project because Rogean said no to a permanent rotation (because that's an awful idea) and because Rog and nilbog "Don't care about it and won't do anything about it so why should I" So he felt like something drastic needed to be done. So he did it.

Sadly, the whole time, all that needed to be done was for the guilds to work together without jumping down each other throats. Training mobs to zoneline was a fun, and very unique version of raiding that didn't exist in any MMO ever. A truly competitive PVE environment.With adrenaline pumping action, and an insanely high skill gap. So if there IS a mess right now, it's us (the players) faults.

So, I disagree it was a terrible idea. I understand it. However.... it did ruin raiding in some ways. Even if we wanted to ignore the fact that rooting the dragons led to this server becoming a one guild ordeal.......... Red hasn't killed vulak once since. I'm almost positive. In fact, raiding is completely dead over there now.

Most interesting though, is that even if ToV was reverted back to March 2019, it wouldn't necessarily be the same as then. You can't push to cancel casting anymore! So while i can't speak intelligently about whether or not that is classic, or if it's over tuned as is (I really don't know at all) you'd probably have to run one hell of a Mana Sieve chain to stop mobs gating.

I do know that if we could move the mobs a little bit (I.E not rooted) that hypothetical 60 man raid comprised of the best raiders on p99 would certainly have a chance at Vulak. We'd be able to engage vulak away from his guards, yet close enough to where he wouldn't gate, even if zone line pulls were no longer viable. My point is there WOULD be wiggle room other than "lol bring more people" or "It's YOUR LEADERSHIPS FAULT FOR NOT FORMING ALLIANCES" or whatever weirdos say.

But, with zero changes made to how the dragons in ToV behave, I can't think of a better answer than, make them a foot race.

[Toryas]

Originally Posted by Twochain [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

2. Racing guarantees you a chance at killing the mob. But it does not guarantee that you kill it. If we win a Vulak FTE at 5am, and can't muster the people to get it down in 2 hours, we don't get the mob. As is, if Vulak spawns at 5am, Riot is getting the mob, virtually 0 chance it's being killed by anyone else.

What's the issue here?

A guild should be handicapped for having a large Eurasia timezone population?

Why should a guild get the chance to send a few players to race for an FTE and then have 2 hours ring fenced until people wake up and log in to have an attempt?

If you can't get a raid force mustered by the time you get FTE yellow text, you shouldn't have the rights to kill it.

[condap99]

Originally Posted by Toryas [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

What's the issue here?

A guild should be handicapped for having a large Eurasia timezone population?

Why should a guild get the chance to send a few players to race for an FTE and then have 2 hours ring fenced until people wake up and log in to have an attempt?

If you can't get a raid force mustered by the time you get FTE yellow text, you shouldn't have the rights to kill it.

No - a guild should not be handicapped for having a large euro/asian population. However, a guild should also not win exclusively because of that either.

The beauty of pull era was that whether your guild was 35 people or 135 people, your guild had a chance. Yes, you had to set up a pull team, and you had to put into place the infrastructure (coth mages at strategic locations, bind points, clickies) - but these obstacles were universal and achievable.

By competing at the spawn point, the 35 person guild and the 135 person guild aren't even playing the same sport. It's no longer about killing the mob. It's about killing the mob with 10 other mobs being trained in various directions so that the 35 person guild cannot compete.

That is why the rule systems are being worked, and ultimately why TOV will either be changed, or blue will continue to wither into nothing.

Also, you never had to have a raid force at time of yellow text. You had to have it mustered by the time it came to camp. And to make this system more fair to smaller guilds, it was switched to a FTE 1hr lockout. This gave small guilds a chance to compete and was very successful. Of course at the time, very few of the smaller guilds showed up, and this is why it was reversed. Really it was only Rustle who used this system to the fullest.

[Damarous]

Just to point out. On E-Marr during velious. The top tear guilds got into a rotation, and they would spend 2-3 days clearing ToV... because they didn't pull the mobs to zone in. Seems classic to me.

[Damarous]

Tier, not tear*

[Bigsham]

TOV Full spawn on red

[Goodest]

Can make an if than statement in the script read the random gina trigger =<900 brah...

[Twochain]

Originally Posted by Goodest [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Can make an if than statement in the script read the random gina trigger =<900 brah...

And have an advantage of what? .25 ms? Every racer is staring at the numbers. The main advantage of having pixel detection is that you do not need to pay attention (i.e staring at your screen ready to click a button for hours on end)

[Goodest]

Brah if it was a truck.... Twochain..

people can:
Script the random trigger read
Script the Run

Script and use pixal detection to run on pop

Script the Coth trigger using the same thing

Its all about client response time AKA ping in the top right corner of your screen.
People are able to eliminate the human factor with today's technology.

The staff loves the human factor of this game no Botting, afk farming ETC. So we move forward with the staffs request of removing all insta coth engages Sev,gore, kt, dain, statue and ETC.