ELI5: Do exp penalty’s get transferred to the group?

[cd288]

Originally Posted by Tecmos Deception [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

On a slightly related note, it'd be fun to see how an exp bonus group and an exp penalty group actually fared over time. People like to say that "well the hybrid penalty isn't bad at all since a SK/pal is a better tank than a warrior so the group is more efficient" or "well a bard brings so much to the table that the 40% penalty is ok" or whatever.

But would a cleric+pal/sk+monk+magi+bard group actually level as fast or faster than a cleric+war+rogue+magi+sham group? Might not be a fair comparison since a sham or chanter is probably a stronger class than a bard even if the bard didn't have an exp penalty.

Except casters have a 10% exp penalty I believe, so if you wanted to have only EXP bonus or neutral classes, wouldn't it have to be only Warriors, Rogues, and priest classes (with no races that have penalties)?

On the Bard, pre-clarity I definitely think a Bard is a huge help for both mana and HP regen. Post-level 29 it's not as helpful since you can just have an Ench with clarity, CC, and great DPS via charming rather than incur the 40% Bard penalty.

[Tecmos Deception]

Originally Posted by cd288 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Except casters have a 10% exp penalty I believe, so if you wanted to have only EXP bonus or neutral classes, wouldn't it have to be only Warriors, Rogues, and priest classes (with no races that have penalties)?

On the Bard, pre-clarity I definitely think a Bard is a huge help for both mana and HP regen. Post-level 29 it's not as helpful since you can just have an Ench with clarity, CC, and great DPS via charming rather than incur the 40% Bard penalty.

I wouldn't really be comparing pure bonuses vs pure penalties. I mostly meant to examine whether the big penalties that people worry about - bards, paladins, SKs, trolls/ogres - can keep up with a similar group composition but without the big exp penalties.

[Hazek]

Some already clarified but i'll try to simplify:

Whoever has the most total exp gets the biggest portion when its divided from a kill.

Hybrids or races with exp penalties take more overall exp to reach the same level as non-hybrid / races so they get a bigger cut at the same level

But since a higher level also has relatively more exp they can also get a bigger cut.

I'm not sure where the line is that makes them equal. But the best grouped exp will be the one that can kill the most efficiently with the least amount of players that are all the same level without any classes or races with penalties.

So just consider the penalty + their level above yours + what they can contribute and decide based on that. And know that somewhere around 2+ levels is about the same as having a hybrid.

[YendorLootmonkey]

I could have sworn the XP needed for each level with class/race modifiers was known. Surprised someone hasn't come up with a quick web app that calculates the percentage of mob XP each group member would get after any group bonuses were added back in.

Or, maybe its better that this doesn't exist...

[Smellybuttface]

Originally Posted by YendorLootmonkey [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I could have sworn the XP needed for each level with class/race modifiers was known. Surprised someone hasn't come up with a quick web app that calculates the percentage of mob XP each group member would get after any group bonuses were added back in.

Or, maybe its better that this doesn't exist...

Are group member exp bonuses calculated at the same time as the penalty’s are? So if an Ogre Warrior with a 15% racial penalty but a 10% class bonus, does this mean it’s in effect a net 5% penalty? I was wondering why I see hardly any SK’s or Paladin’s in game, so I’m guessing this penalty hits a lot harder than I thought it would. Makes me almost not want to group with anything but Halfling Rogues.

[Tecmos Deception]

Just doing my usual devil's advocate thing here: the example of 16 and 20? The warrior is only like 10% more exp than the SK but by being both a warrior AND 4 levels higher, will be a monstrously stronger tank. A level 15 that beats up the SK decent won't scratch the warrior, an 18 that annihilates the SK would be just another blue con for the warrior, etc.

While it's true that a level 16 has 4x as much exp as a level 10, it's not really something that comes up a lot I don't think.

[Cen]

He said explain like hes 5, so please use cookies pies or baklava analogies

[fadetree]

The origin of the way exp works in groups is easier to understand if you know what it was based on. The intent is to have people in a group that all fight together progress towards their next ding at the same rate. When you get exp, you really need to think of it as distance covered to your next ding rather than some number of points. A troll sk has a longer distance to cover than the halfling does, so the only way to keep them getting the same distance covered is to move the troll a little more than the halfling. Since they only have 1 unchanging experience amount to share, that means the troll takes some points away from the halfling. But - If they start in a group with no exp earned, and they fight all night in that group until they ding, they would ding at approximately the same time.

[Hazek]

Originally Posted by fadetree [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The origin of the way exp works in groups is easier to understand if you know what it was based on. The intent is to have people in a group that all fight together progress towards their next ding at the same rate. When you get exp, you really need to think of it as distance covered to your next ding rather than some number of points. A troll sk has a longer distance to cover than the halfling does, so the only way to keep them getting the same distance covered is to move the troll a little more than the halfling. Since they only have 1 unchanging experience amount to share, that means the troll takes some points away from the halfling. But - If they start in a group with no exp earned, and they fight all night in that group until they ding, they would ding at approximately the same time.

Couldn't they just have everyone get an even split? Cause I thought they had the exp penalties because they assumed some races / classes were stronger and would level faster.

[Tecmos Deception]

Originally Posted by Hazek [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Couldn't they just have everyone get an even split? Cause I thought they had the exp penalties because they assumed some races / classes were stronger and would level faster.

The original EQ devs are like the original D&D devs.

"Hey guys, I just thought up this thing we'll call THAC0! It'll be the perfect way to determine hits and misses!"