Monk mitigation too high?

[Torven]

Originally Posted by soup [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The plate tanks with similar gear will have much more HP than the monk will have, thus CH is much more efficient.

On my warrior, shaman and cleric buffs account for nearly 50% of my hitpoints. There isn't going to be a huge difference between monk and tank hp with both shaman and cleric buffs on. Any HP advantage means jack so long as your group never has to stop pulling due to cleric mana. Not to mention the extra dps, aggro generation, and fungi regen/mend heals are going to mitigate any hp advantage as well.

Originally Posted by soup [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This statement is pretty much useless since there are FAR more monks with great gear than tanks with great gear. Damn near everyone has a monk twink, shouldn't be a surprise that people see a lot of monks who can tank. (keep in mind, the term "twink" can be used to reflect on characters even when they're in their 50s)

But I'm sure someone will try and turn that into a circular argument by saying "There's more monks because of how OP they are!"

Oh yeah. I'm sure monks are the favorite alt class because they are so terrible. Just like there were so many magicians prekunark because they were so awful. Really.

All that monk AC comes from super expensive gear that few monks can attain, amiright?

Originally Posted by soup [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Why does the gear other classes have access to bother you? Why do you want to celebrate someone else getting slapped in the face?

Because the power of one class affects all the other classes. If one class is a DPS and tank class in one, then there is no reason to group a tank. This isn't difficult to understand.

Some of the best exp my enchanter friend ever got was trioing disco with a monk and necro. So much for CH HP advantages.

[Numbers_]

If it's like it was during classic then complaining is just pissing in the wind.

I think, like soup said, a lot of what people see as overpowered monks are just people who are twinked out with regen robes and other twink stuff. I don't tank very well because i'm untwinked and have pretty "normal" equipment.

I hear it gets even crazier during velious, but isn't nerfed at least until lucin.

[packmule]

FD is working as intended. most def

[goodthink]

monk mit was nerfed until some time after the launch of luclin. I clearly remember the nerf affecting my beastlord AND monk.

It was part of classic, and the fact remains warriors were/are still the best at raid mobs.

[Rais]

Here is another good link.

http://www.thesteelwarrior.org/forum...hp/t-3941.html

The monk nerf is probably the silliest thing that VI did in hindsight.
They nerfed monks for 2 things that added up to one reason.
a) poor itemization. Prepop monks could get too close in AC
to thier plate counterparts
b) low mob attacks. Prepop mobs had a low attack.
a+b = prepop Monks came very close to warrior/plate mitigation yet had an avoidance edge.

Problem you'll notice is the timinig of the nerf, and words "prepop"
It was what only a couple weeks till POP came out? POP
fixed A+B itself. Monks no longer come close to plates in AC.
And AC does matter vs high attack mobs.

[Doors]

Monk mitigation isn't high enough.

[Hasbinbad]

None of this matters because AC as a whole is borked on p99.. it just doesn't work. You guys are barking up the wrong tree.

[Breuce]

I really wish I had more actual valuable input to add, but since I play a low 30s nec on P99 I don't.

However, I will say that Kunark was truly where monks shined and many people who didn't play monk didn't recognize it even back then. I played a monk main through the years, and Monks could really tank like mofos, until the very high levels/raid mob types. I used to 'prefer' having a war in the group to tank, but decently geared we could tank our faces off and it wasn't a necessity, especially in single group EXP type stuff.

I don't know if monk AC is borked in p99. I can't comment on that.

But I do remember quite well how powerful monks were on live, and I will say their tanking abilities were quite underrated... remember, this was still a period where many people who rolled monks were trying as hard as they could to max AGI and DEX for some reason. With a bunch of solid AC/HP gear and good weapons, we fell behind in tanking in the high levels for two reasons:

A)Our HP was low, and our Mitigation was low enough that boss, raid level mobs would brutalize us and our tanking was so inconsistent that trying to run CHeal chains on us was hilariously futile. Tanking mobs significantly higher level than us = death trap, in just about every situation you can imagine.

B)We. Didn't. Have. Taunt. We had disarm though, and a lot of us used it really hard, pretending it was that useful for aggro.

Other than that, a well geared well played Monk could tank like an absolute mofo in an awful lot of situations. Don't worry, if the timeline follows right, near the end of Velious we'll take a huge Mitigation nerf, and we'll share our best weapons with wars, pals and all the others, and we'll all bitch about it more than you all can handle

[wehrmacht]

Originally Posted by Kanz [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Just curious, who are you? Would love if you're the monk who taught me how to pull nToV!

Fraud

Originally Posted by Breuce [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

However, I will say that Kunark was truly where monks shined and many people who didn't play monk didn't recognize it even back then.

Yea, I saw someone complain about monks being able to solo camps in Karnors. I could solo the jail in Karnors at 57 with monk epic & 13/21 offhand during velious. Most hits from skeletal guardians would be for high damage and I really didn't mitigate anything, I did avoid a good bit of hits though. The DPS was pretty high and the mobs didn't really have that much HP so even if I got hit for max damage every time I'd probably still have killed them.

I remember having to fight Call of Sathir every time he spawned, I could also solo him but I think I needed to have 100% hp and mend up and if slow landed, think I had to run.

[Hoggen]

There are no details given for mitigation, but a major melee overhaul was done in the October 8, 2001 patch. I recall from memory our monk complaining about mitigation nerf at that time (pre-Luclin), but can give no specifics, and the links that told said specifics no longer exist that I can find.