Enchanter "DPS"

[Rimitto]

Originally Posted by Torik [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

My advice: Sell your ~1k robe. Buy the Rod + 400pp in CHA items I recommended. Stop focusing on tradeskills (except research) until you are 50+ and can make 500pp an hour. IMO, if you're not charming, you should play another class that better suits your playstyle, because once you are 40+ charming is pretty much your only option (unless you just wanna be a buff bot). 148 CHA is a little low.. A charming enchanter should have at least 200 CHA (buffed). I hope this helps!

Edit: You may have mentioned this already, but what level are the mobs you are charming as a level 25 enc? I would not try to charm anything higher than level 21. Also, are you tashing them before you charm them?

Edit 2: There are also 7 CHA / 5 DEX rings you can get for 150pp each, once you get the Rod and 400pp in gear I mentioned.

Nah I think I'll just stick with enchanter because it plays just like another class I used to play in another game... that is to say, it's an area control/stun class. Please understand that I have no intention of ignoring the most useful spells in this class, so things like charm are 3rd rate to me, since they are a 1-trick pony with a broken leg. I've already got the basics of taking 5-6 groups of monsters that range from green-blue solo down with the last dungeon, so the skill tree/mana affordance is definitely starting to open up to me.
(a small bit of information, in the game I played before this, the "enchanters" job was to intercept and interrupt the enemies spellcasting and skilluse and to prevent various other things from occurring such as summonings, specials, and critical hits. It was a true form intercept class, and as such, I plan to develop my metagame in this such fashion. Most of the spells are here and the system is similar, but everyone seems to just have a screwed up attitude about what enchanters should be.)

EDIT 1 response: I'm not, charm sucks. I've tried charming more times than mueller's had chances to "take down trump". Ironically, the best charm I ever had was on a yellow orc in oasis a good amount of levels ago. I've been trying to make it functional on whites, greens, and blues since then but... all of them just don't work. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
As far as levels, I'm not pitiful enough yet to go look up the individual monster levels.
I've been going by the game's general standard color coding system, but mostly sticking to whites and blues when I can. Greens if I have to, and yellows if I am confident or in a tight spot. I realize there are different layers/levels within the coloring system, but it's a good judge if I can take something..... usually... which matters way more to me.

EDIT 2 response: I'm not ignoring cha gear, but It will not be my biggest concern from now on, thanks for clearing this up for me.

Originally Posted by Crawdad [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think this rant is particularly funny, as you'll be hard pressed to find a less min/max'er than me (except for anything Iksar related). You seem rather trolly, but I think there's a lot of good information that will come out of this thread for those who don't take suggestions as a personal attack. What does a full Str/Dex enchanter look like? Rather poor while leveling. Cha has a painfully obvious effect on charm.

you call yourself a mix/maxer, but you cannot even answer the question about a min/max when asked. I asked what they looked like, not what their charm looked like. but please, do go on. Surely the charmer class has plenty of interesting builds on it. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
(True story, I actually saw someone talking about an agility build last week, the numbers were very interesting, to say the least)

Originally Posted by Crawdad [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Twinking is a big part of this game to some people, and others prefer to go at it naked. My enchanter enjoyed starting life with a dragoon dirk and crude stein for certain [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] You can most certainly start charming at 12 while mostly naked. The minotaurs in Steamfont are my favorite place as a lowbie enchanter, as its two sets of two near a zoneline. I usually melee it up with the old animation until 14, though.



Charming is the fastest way to level, for any class that can do it. You can look here, or ask a high level enchanter in-game, and find a wealth of information about it and its benefits/challenges. But I get the feeling from this and other comments that you aren't really here for anything other than trolling [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

funny I get the same feeling from you, that you're only trolling.
I really liked the part where you flatout bald faced admitted to twinking while having the audacity to say that it's "easier". I mean, let's be real, if I had 1 million dollars, it would probably be pretty easy to buy a high end gaming computer, rather than working up and saving money to buy one. Analogies eh man?
I get ya though, you're completely out of touch, don't worry, I get it. It happens. You even said yourself "Ask a High Level Enchanter". Why don't we just reverse the situation then? Dear high level enchanters, what weapons do the higher level animations use and what's their DPS ratio range between a bad summoned animation and a high summoned animation? Furthermore, What are the best combinations of spells that can be used to dismantle groups of 7 or more at a standstill standoff while maintaining a decent balance of MP -> damage ratio. These are the things I would like to know as I progress. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
(I really hope the mesmerization line beefs up its time limit by 40)

Originally Posted by Crawdad [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Tradeskills and ports are plat sinks. There's no reason to spend your money on either at low levels. You can't throw a stone without hitting a leveling/plat guide for p99. Enchanters have some of the easiest time earning money while leveling as well. It is very easy to have 2k by the mid-20s.

Funny, I guess I just skipped all that then... my highest earnings have been 1.6k which I spent on a stupid looking robe, spells, and various other things. Most of that has been new money too from the horrible grind from 22-24. Oh speaking of that, bandit sashes are not going to be viable in the next update. That's one thing I've noticed is that every couple of levels when animations hit 3 daggers, they become horribly outdated... yet once they make that jump they becoming incredibly strong. I guess you wouldn't know of that though, you never use them.

[snyder43]

I give you a lot of credit for taking the path less traveled. If you ever start streaming (or Youtubing), let me know and I'll be glad to tune in.

[Crawdad]

Originally Posted by Rimitto [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

funny I get the same feeling from you, that you're only trolling.
I really liked the part where you flatout bald faced admitted to twinking while having the audacity to say that it's "easier". I mean, let's be real, if I had 1 million dollars, it would probably be pretty easy to buy a high end gaming computer, rather than working up and saving money to buy one. Analogies eh man?

Twinking is fine, not twinking is fine. A dragoon dirk is ~50p and a crude stein is ~10p. Piecemeal your gear as you can afford it (whatever type of gear you want).

I get ya though, you're completely out of touch, don't worry, I get it. It happens. You even said yourself "Ask a High Level Enchanter". Why don't we just reverse the situation then? Dear high level enchanters, what weapons do the higher level animations use and what's their DPS ratio range between a bad summoned animation and a high summoned animation? Furthermore, What are the best combinations of spells that can be used to dismantle groups of 7 or more at a standstill standoff while maintaining a decent balance of MP -> damage ratio. These are the things I would like to know as I progress. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
(I really hope the mesmerization line beefs up its time limit by 40)

Animations don't spawn with gear, their graphics just change depending on level. Pets scale pretty well to mobs until ~20 and the disparity only gets worse as you get higher level. If you want to give me an example of a large camp I'd tell you how I'd do it, but basically make use of lull (another reason to have high Cha), charm and root. Use your PB stuns and mez if needed and use your lowest level root/mez. GINA helps if you get bogged down trying to keep time. You almost always want to use your lowest level mez, root and PB stun (though you want multiple PB stuns mem'd when you're able).

Funny, I guess I just skipped all that then... my highest earnings have been 1.6k which I spent on a stupid looking robe, spells, and various other things. Most of that has been new money too from the horrible grind from 22-24. Oh speaking of that, bandit sashes are not going to be viable in the next update. That's one thing I've noticed is that every couple of levels when animations hit 3 daggers, they become horribly outdated... yet once they make that jump they becoming incredibly strong. I guess you wouldn't know of that though, you never use them.

Here's my low level plat routine:

 

1-5 Qeynos newbie yard
5-10 Qeynos hills Rabid animals, gnolls
11-16 Eruds, NK, Qeynos hills Wisps
16-19 Bandits in WK, Lfay
19-25 Paineel guards

I've leveled several characters (both twinked and untwinked) this route and had ~2k in the bank in the early 20s. Animations have a use otherwise Zumaik's Animation wouldn't cost 5k. That doesn't mean it fulfills the same purpose as charming.

I'm a big proponent of charming for any class that can do it. You definitely don't Have to do it, and I often take breaks on my necro and druid to level other ways. Play however you want, but be aware that no one has ever seen an Enchanter leveling with a summoned pet and thought "That guy knows what he's doing." Being good at charming will make you a desirable member of a group and get you invites for a long time. I've seen many groups smack-talk lazy enchanters, because no other class makes a good group amazing like an Enchanter who knows what he's doing (charming, lulling, CC'ing).

more times than mueller's had chances to "take down trump"

(True story, I actually saw someone talking about an agility build last week, the numbers were very interesting, to say the least)

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[Varren]

Theres also no reason to use a higher level charm spell if the lower one will land. It just uses more mana.

[Zipity]

Are you casting tash before you charm?

[1asdfasdf1]

You guys are talking about nothing but DPS and keeping your distance from mobs. Where are you fighting? Outdoors 24/7? Hardly a compelling argument. Max DPS means nothing when it it murders the entire group and causes a 90 minute CR in Guk. That's what I see: 90 minute CRs and clerics OOM from helping reroot and stun and keep the enchanter alive.

You guys are making the fallacy of remembering the highs (wow the hasted siren backstabbed for 80,000!) and forgetting the lows (oh shit the siren backstabbed us all for 80,000).

[Baylan295]

Originally Posted by 1asdfasdf1 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You guys are talking about nothing but DPS and keeping your distance from mobs. Where are you fighting? Outdoors 24/7? Hardly a compelling argument. Max DPS means nothing when it it murders the entire group and causes a 90 minute CR in Guk. That's what I see: 90 minute CRs and clerics OOM from helping reroot and stun and keep the enchanter alive.

You guys are making the fallacy of remembering the highs (wow the hasted siren backstabbed for 80,000!) and forgetting the lows (oh shit the siren backstabbed us all for 80,000).

Skillful play as an enchanter greatly reduces the risk of a nasty mob wiping the group. If you are concerned, there are a lot of things you can do to minimize risk. For example: have your pet snared or malo’d, find a less dangerous pet (either lower level or less DPS), or don’t fully kit out a pet. Oftentimes, people will approach me and say I should get a “better” pet. Yet, if the group has downtime in camp, there is no need or reason to increase the risk by increasing DPS. Similarly, if your heals are coming slow or not at all, you can always choose to calm and camp off a pet and it will go home.

[Varren]

Originally Posted by 1asdfasdf1 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You guys are talking about nothing but DPS and keeping your distance from mobs. Where are you fighting? Outdoors 24/7? Hardly a compelling argument. Max DPS means nothing when it it murders the entire group and causes a 90 minute CR in Guk. That's what I see: 90 minute CRs and clerics OOM from helping reroot and stun and keep the enchanter alive.

You guys are making the fallacy of remembering the highs (wow the hasted siren backstabbed for 80,000!) and forgetting the lows (oh shit the siren backstabbed us all for 80,000).

No, we are not. Pet dps is best, and it is manageable. You can keep a pet under control with your berserker+rune lines, stun and mez. Learn it and be good

[kjs86z]

Originally Posted by 1asdfasdf1 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You guys are talking about nothing but DPS and keeping your distance from mobs. Where are you fighting? Outdoors 24/7? Hardly a compelling argument. Max DPS means nothing when it it murders the entire group and causes a 90 minute CR in Guk. That's what I see: 90 minute CRs and clerics OOM from helping reroot and stun and keep the enchanter alive.

You guys are making the fallacy of remembering the highs (wow the hasted siren backstabbed for 80,000!) and forgetting the lows (oh shit the siren backstabbed us all for 80,000).

You're just proving your ignorance.

I have hundreds, if not thousands of hours having active charm pets....from solo, groups of all sizes, and raids.

I spent the vast majority of 50-60 with a RL cleric friend. He very rarely ever dropped below 50% mana. Said it was the easiest / fastest 50-60 char he'd ever leveled. Did we die sometimes? Of course, especially before Bedlam and where we were learning new zones / camps. You just have to CR and keep going. For those that you feel are too risky, plenty of rogues around that would be more than happy to drag for a nice tip.

You and the OP just need practice. It'll get easier with levels and by your mid 30s you'll be cruising.

[Wallicker]

Charm break -> stun(20mana) -> mez(20mana) -> tash(10 mana) -> recharm(70mana).
That’s 120mana. If your parking your pet far away you can mez before it gets to you saving 20 mana. If it breaks early it should already be tashed saving additional 10 mana and if you have someone snare it you can just tash+recharm. So 80 to 120 mana if a pet breaks. At lvl 26 with breeze, you regain around 15 mana per tic sitting so you will recover that mana in less than one minute... hardly some exhaustive feat that can’t be pulled off you just need to practice.