Necro lull -- this can't be classic.

[commongood]

Played a chanter on live from Kunark till OoW. Currently play a 58 chanter grinding towards 60 and a 60 necro.

I don't recall charisma being a penalty on live for enchanters. I also don't recognize your ratio of failures on your necromancer on p99 from my own necromancer. But yes, I would agree that my 255 enchanter get's fewer crit resists.

All anecdotal I know. I'm not sure what that link to Daybreak Forums accomplishes as I couldn't be bothered sifting through everything. Is the quote

"Yes it is. It varies on a number of spells to its actual usefulness but it does have a use. There are different levels of charisma for different classes. The system does take into account that an Enchanter should have a higher charisma than say a Necromancer. It�s unfair to expect masters of the undead to be entirely charismatic. "

from a developer?

Like others have already chimed in with: if you can find some evidence then you should post it under bug reports and if the p99 team finds that evidence backs up that it's a classic feature then you will have succeeded.

Better chance than coming to the caster subforum and being confrontational and unpleasent to people trying to give you feedback on your questions.

[DMN]

Originally Posted by commongood [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Played a chanter on live from Kunark till OoW. Currently play a 58 chanter grinding towards 60 and a 60 necro.

I don't recall charisma being a penalty on live for enchanters. I also don't recognize your ratio of failures on your necromancer on p99 from my own necromancer. But yes, I would agree that my 255 enchanter get's fewer crit resists.

All anecdotal I know. I'm not sure what that link to Daybreak Forums accomplishes as I couldn't be bothered sifting through everything. Is the quote from a developer?

Like others have already chimed in with: if you can find some evidence then you should post it under bug reports and if the p99 team finds that evidence backs up that it's a classic feature then you will have succeeded.

Better chance than coming to the caster subforum and being confrontational and unpleasent to people trying to give you feedback on your questions.

That quote is from geoffrey zatkin, not only a dev but the main guy in charge of the spell system in the classic era.

[commongood]

Thanks. So according to that quote (the link is broken btw - the link posted by the quote on the dbg forums) "The system does take into account that an Enchanter should have a higher charisma than say a Necromancer". That's pretty vague. It doesn't really specify the reason why an enchanter should have a higher charisma. Is it because it will benefit the enchanter more? Or is it because he will otherwise be punished?

I'm not entirely convinced either way but it would be interesting to learn more.

[DMN]

Originally Posted by commongood [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Thanks. So according to that quote (the link is broken btw - the link posted by the quote on the dbg forums) "The system does take into account that an Enchanter should have a higher charisma than say a Necromancer". That's pretty vague. It doesn't really specify the reason why an enchanter should have a higher charisma. Is it because it will benefit the enchanter more? Or is it because he will otherwise be punished?

I'm not entirely convinced either way but it would be interesting to learn more.

Well it suggests that an enchanter had a relative charisma penalty versus a necromancer. Alternatively that necros had a charisma bonus relative to enchanters.

[commongood]

It may suggest that but it's unclear. When he says "it means that a chanter should have a higher charisma than a necromancer" that could mean a number of things.

It could mean, as you suggest, that the chanter would have a lower chance of succesfully rolling on charm/lull/mez checks if the chanter had the same charisma as a necromancer.

But it could also mean that a chanter has much more to gain from having high charisma. As in the enchanter will benefit more from having a high charisma and therefore should have a higher charisma.

I'm not saying it's one way or the other, but just that it's a little vague to draw any hard conclusions based on that quote.

[DMN]

Maybe if your english or logic skills are extremely poor. You seemed to have missed the part where he says it would be wrong for the system to expect "masters of the undead" necros to have as much charisma as other classes.

[commongood]

Originally Posted by DMN [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Maybe if your english or logic skills are extremely poor. You seemed to have missed the part where he says it would be wrong for the system to expect "masters of the undead" necros to have as much charisma as other classes.

I don't think my logic skills (I assume you are refering to my logistical sense?) or my level of understanding of English need to be brought into question.

I also think it's a bit contrived to assume that this throw-away comment about how necros shouldn't be expected to have high charisma directly translates into a confirmation of your theory.

[DMN]

Originally Posted by commongood [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't think my logic skills (I assume you are refering to my logistical sense?) or my level of understanding of English need to be brought into question.

I also think it's a bit contrived to assume that this throw-away comment about how necros shouldn't be expected to have high charisma directly translates into a confirmation of your theory.

The whole point of the second sentence was to elucidate readers on the former. They didn't expect necros to have high charisma, but they did enchanters. GZ is the most important figure in EQ history for classic time period spell issues. Nothing he says should be flippantly considered a throwaway line.

[LazyHydras]

I will say that coming up as a necro I would literally never use lull because it seemed like the resist chance was always 50% and the crit resist chance at least 25%. I have only recently started using it at lvl60 and it seems to have much more success. . . but only because I outlevel the mobs by at least 12 or 13 levels (HS North or West mobs).

Resist rates, OVERALL, seem unusually high in P99. Trying to land snare/fear on mobs (specifically in my mid to late 20s) was always a chore and I'd have to expect numerous resists even on blue con mobs before anything would land. When you are not twinked (i.e: have a low mana pool), it really makes soloing much less efficient than you'd expect it to be despite the fact that you aren't taking any damage.

[Haynar]

OP has inspired me. I should look at how lull works ASAP!!!!

But thanks for the reminder. It may need a revamp.

H