A public apology to Clorox.

[Messianic]

Whatever the group agrees upon is the rule.

However, I hate NBG. It's so easily abused. Nothing stops people from using "need" to get a really good class item and then just sell it - and odds are they eventually will. Tstaff - maybe not, but it's still a maybe.

Even if i'm the monk when Tstaff drops, someone else could probably make just as good use of the cash from selling it, since the value is transferable, and no one has to wonder whether or not that monk is simply going to sell it a month from now and twink a different class.

If everyone rolls on stuff, everyone has an equal shot at the same value the item represents. That's far more equitable than installing the infallible notion of "need" which people turn around and abuse. If the group opts to give the class-specific item to the person who would use it the most effectively, fine. But especially for PUGs, it's not equitable to NBG if you're holding a camp that drops stuff that 2 or 3 people will never use. Assuming that they'll be in a situation at some other time where they're that class that needs everything a certain camp drops is just an assumption.

TL;DR - Instead of NBG, how about we admit everyone is greedy (we're playing a freaking game where the goal is to have fun, but also get better gear) and embrace it.

[Tolinn]

Originally Posted by Messianic [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Whatever the group agrees upon is the rule.

However, I hate NBG. It's so easily abused. Nothing stops people from using "need" to get a really good class item and then just sell it - and odds are they eventually will. Tstaff - maybe not, but it's still a maybe.

Even if i'm the monk when Tstaff drops, someone else could probably make just as good use of the cash from selling it, since the value is transferable, and no one has to wonder whether or not that monk is simply going to sell it a month from now and twink a different class.

If everyone rolls on stuff, everyone has an equal shot at the same value the item represents. That's far more equitable than installing the infallible notion of "need" which people turn around and abuse. If the group opts to give the class-specific item to the person who would use it the most effectively, fine. But especially for PUGs, it's not equitable to NBG if you're holding a camp that drops stuff that 2 or 3 people will never use. Assuming that they'll be in a situation at some other time where they're that class that needs everything a certain camp drops is just an assumption.

TL;DR - Instead of NBG, how about we admit everyone is greedy (we're playing a freaking game where the goal is to have fun, but also get better gear) and embrace it.

This. I recently was in a group where someone NBGed an item, didn't equip it, and then attempted to sell it before I called them out on it. Sorry, but I just don't trust PUGs enough to do NBG. That being said, I'm not going to disband myself from a group if NBG is the determined loot system, but it's not what I advocate.

T

[casdegere]

Originally Posted by Messianic [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Whatever the group agrees upon is the rule.

However, I hate NBG. It's so easily abused. Nothing stops people from using "need" to get a really good class item and then just sell it - and odds are they eventually will. Tstaff - maybe not, but it's still a maybe.

Even if i'm the monk when Tstaff drops, someone else could probably make just as good use of the cash from selling it, since the value is transferable, and no one has to wonder whether or not that monk is simply going to sell it a month from now and twink a different class.

If everyone rolls on stuff, everyone has an equal shot at the same value the item represents. That's far more equitable than installing the infallible notion of "need" which people turn around and abuse. If the group opts to give the class-specific item to the person who would use it the most effectively, fine. But especially for PUGs, it's not equitable to NBG if you're holding a camp that drops stuff that 2 or 3 people will never use. Assuming that they'll be in a situation at some other time where they're that class that needs everything a certain camp drops is just an assumption.

TL;DR - Instead of NBG, how about we admit everyone is greedy (we're playing a freaking game where the goal is to have fun, but also get better gear) and embrace it.

There are people on this server with only 1 character that do not "camp" in EC to buy an item they are wanting. They get in groups and camp the mob that drops it.

Say you are a Monk in UGUK grouping and getting xp. You show up at the entrance and slap LFG on. Your telling me you would argue tooth and nail if the group was camping Scryer or AC and the INT bracers or sleeves dropped with casters in your group that need them?

I will contend it might be different for 50+ levels camping things. But mark me when I say, if there are 4 guildies that invite people into your group because you need them with the intend to shuttle any dropped items amongst yourselves, expect an argument if you don't communicate your intentions to the person you intend to chump.

[Messianic]

Originally Posted by casdegere [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

There are people on this server with only 1 character that do not "camp" in EC to buy an item they are wanting. They get in groups and camp the mob that drops it.

That's nice, but it's irrelevant to what I was saying.

Originally Posted by casdegere [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Say you are a Monk in UGUK grouping and getting xp. You show up at the entrance and slap LFG on. Your telling me you would argue tooth and nail if the group was camping Scryer or AC and the INT bracers or sleeves dropped with casters in your group that need them?

No, actually my first statement indicates I wouldn't do that. Again, whatever the group agrees is the rule. If they have 5 people who are NBGing, I can leave - but I can't make them change the rule. I don't know if this is the case for you, but people seem terrified to actually discuss loot rules sometimes - as if it's a "dirty" subject or something. That's the primary way to get punked - not talk about something which is one of the primary reasons you're even in the group.

Originally Posted by casdegere [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I will contend it might be different for 50+ levels camping things. But mark me when I say, if there are 4 guildies that invite people into your group because you need them with the intend to shuttle any dropped items amongst yourselves, expect an argument if you don't communicate your intentions to the person you intend to chump.

If you never check what loot rules are - particularly if the rest of the people in the group are guildies - you're going to eventually get chumped if you play for any length of time. Fact. You assumed something that wasn't true - that the group would be NBG - and that's your fault. I sure hope group communication skills extend beyond "thx for invite", "incoming mob", "add", and "heal plz."

[jilena]

Too much thought put into all of this. NBG = A greedy selfish loot system. Everyone needs money, any item that is tradeable is worth money. The feeling that an item is yours simply because you can equip it is greedy and selfish. "Greeding" all tradeable items is the least greedy system.

Do I insist on rolling on everything? No. Not so much because NBG is more fair, but because I don't give that much of a shit. Would I take advantage of NBG in a group where it was the agreed upon loot system? Yes, assuming I would actually use the item.

*shrug*

[Ashimar]

Posting an Apology thread in the R&F forum? Project99 Characters need a new stat, lets call it "Common Sense"

[Japan]

Originally Posted by Ashimar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Posting an Apology thread in the R&F forum? Project99 Characters need a new stat, lets call it "Common Sense"

ingame charisma should be dictated by number of R&F posts imo

[Knuckle]

I'd just like to say, if you had played on VZTZ, you almost always grouped with guildies, if you grouped with guildies, you were awarded the item if it was class specific or an upgrade for your class, if no one needed the item as an upgrade, you could roll on it. In PuG settings it was pretty much the same thing, I rarely if ever in my 3 year tenure saw the bluebie pixelitis kick in, unless your name was Kaahbal.

It's very sad how degenerate and malicious bluebies get towards pixels, and it's sad that they can't transfer this pixel aggression into a pvp setting, its like a snapping turtle that only comes out when something shiny is near.

[Foxx]

Originally Posted by Knuckle [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

unless your name was Kaahbal.

lold

[Alawen Everywhere]

Originally Posted by Knuckle [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'd just like to say, if you had played on VZTZ, you almost always grouped with guildies, if you grouped with guildies, you were awarded the item if it was class specific or an upgrade for your class, if no one needed the item as an upgrade, you could roll on it. In PuG settings it was pretty much the same thing, I rarely if ever in my 3 year tenure saw the bluebie pixelitis kick in, unless your name was Kaahbal.

It's very sad how degenerate and malicious bluebies get towards pixels, and it's sad that they can't transfer this pixel aggression into a pvp setting, its like a snapping turtle that only comes out when something shiny is near.

VZTZ never had an economy. You're trying to claim some kind of moral high ground when the real fact is lack of resources.