@Sirken "a fair and legitimate chance at that target"

[Nexii]

The only alternative to FTE racing that would work is quake pops instead of raid bosses popping on variance. But it's 'not classic' in the eyes of the staff (or at least the devs), so it's not likely.

My counterarguments are
1) This server has ~5-10x the endgame raiders that a classic server would have had. No classic server would have been this overpopulated at the endgame, Verant/Sony would have opened a new shard.
2) FTE racing rules from zoneline and yellow text were never a thing in classic.
3) Nor were GM-enforced one hour or one day mercy rules after an FTE.
4) Staff does quakes when they please anyhow.
5) Adding to this, many raid bosses drop much less loot than on classic. Thus further reducing the size of the pie.

[Fasttimes]

Velious is way better then kunark. who wanted to coth duck a whole VS window or 3 premade groups cothing for trak for 30sec engages. you wouldnt compete back then. The mobilization was crazy fast then too. you can be quite lazy now with an hour to kill shit. Nothings perfect but racing is indefinitely better then 20 mages per wing like it use to be and definitely more casual friendly then camping at doubles and aary stairs and jav pulling with instant engages, try doing that casually.

[Skew]

Originally Posted by Fasttimes [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Velious is way better then kunark. who wanted to coth duck a whole VS window or 3 premade groups cothing for trak for 30sec engages. you wouldnt compete back then. The mobilization was crazy fast then too. you can be quite lazy now with an hour to kill shit. Nothings perfect but racing is indefinitely better then 20 mages per wing like it use to be and definitely more casual friendly then camping at doubles and aary stairs and jav pulling with instant engages, try doing that casually.

Or getting a PD batphone at 3am and that its our fte and mob will be in camp in 90 seconds

[kotton05]

Qani you're just hurting your members as much as you're effecting all of us. It's not like you guys would get much of anything without an agreement and once you show an effective force you then diverge to show you deserve more of the pie. currently you are just creating an environment that will work against you re think it.

[Phantasm]

A guild has 1 hour to attempt a target after they have initially FTE'd it. What they do with that 1 hour is theirs. It prevents them from engaging another target so its usually killed quick. What they do with the mob is their business. Any other guild could have taken FTE upon the one hour mark.

Besides, I'm sure no other guild has skirted the spirit of the rules, right?

[t3kn34k]

Fixing the current racing rules for more 'fair' competition is simple with a few tweaks to the current system.

-Coth for FTE would be much better (if you're looking for a fair playing field) //this is the most important change. There is always going to be someone doing sketch shit with the footraces... sorry, but its true.
-2 max past zone in (server rules) would mean guilds have to select mage placement based on what is in window.
-Keep the 1hour lock but maybe change the lock a little (1 hour exclusive lock in but also locked out from new FTEs for 1 hour seems to make the most sense)
Add the following mobs to 1hour lock:
-Dain
-Klandicar
-Zlandicar
-Yelinak

EZ
(but no one will read this so continue your regularly scheduled thread)

[Phantasm]

What are you looking for here Maner ? An apology ? Infernus gave a mob a shot, realized they were in over their heads and an hour passed with them not securing the mob. CSG got the fresh FTE and said hey infernus we'll show you some things on how we do this mob. Whats wrong with this? You're making mountains out of molehills

[Maner]

Originally Posted by Phantasm [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

What are you looking for here Maner ? An apology ? Infernus gave a mob a shot, realized they were in over their heads and an hour passed with them not securing the mob. CSG got the fresh FTE and said hey infernus we'll show you some things on how we do this mob. Whats wrong with this? You're making mountains out of molehills

an apology for what? I was pointing out the kind of precedence this sets. Literally any guild can run for an FTE knowing they wont be able to kill the target and after securing an FTE search the market for one of the raid groups willing to kill it with them. Infernus got screwed by the loot rules CSG uses but im sure a more favorable agreement can be found out there.

The issue i have a problem with is a group securing FTE and failing then being able to get onto the logs for the next entity that attempts the target. That seems completely against the spirit of the rules.

[Skew]

Originally Posted by Maner [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Literally any guild can run for an FTE knowing they wont be able to kill the target and after securing an FTE search the market for one of the raid groups willing to kill it with them. That seems completely against the spirit of the rules.

Why? Seems fine. Any guild that helps on that FTE is locked out until the target is dead or a wipe or 1 hour. Cant really exploit that system for FTEing multiple targets.
If you make a bunch of smaller guilds you just make more stress over sharing pixels. So this really isnt a big deal. Not seeing where the problem is in "selling FTEs"

If a guild with 5 people in you'd never heard of got a Doze FTE and then said "Aftermath would you like to team up with us on this , we just want 1 tear you take the rest" or w/e loot deal was struck , you'd jump at the chance and why not?
Small guild are locked into Doze and youre locked into Doze.

[bktroost]

Originally Posted by Maner [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Infernus got screwed by the loot rules CSG uses but im sure a more favorable agreement can be found out there.

No they won't. Because precisely what happened would happen again. they would wait out their timer and another guild would get the FTE.

CSG got the FTE after them and didn't need infernus to kill it at that point. It was, by rights, entirely CSGs because of our refte. We then included them in our alliance for that kill like we do for all three of our guilds. Standard contract.


So why would AM ever help Infernus kill it when they could just put some monks there to refte and kill it solo? Or AW? Or rustle?

Your scenario won't ever happen. The only reason it did happen here is because CSG wanted to not leapfrog Infernus and included them on our reFTE because we don't do the highly competitive thing... even though, legally, there is nothing wrong with it.