Game Mechanics: spell gem refresh with instant clicky does not refresh all spell gems correctly

[Grimjaw]

http://www.eqclerics.org/forums/show...2&postcount=13

The recast on all spells unless otherwise specified is 2.0 seconds. Think of it as a spell cool of time. You have to include these 2.0 seconds in all your calculations. That said, using insta click items you can exploit to get around the 2.0 second recast, but verant hard coded fast casting spells to prevent this, you notice the "Spell recovery time not met" messages

So ya, thats probably the old missing mechanic - not all spells even listed a recast. for spells with no recast it was just the 2 second global cooldown holding them back, and THAT is what clickies circumvented.

[Grimjaw]

aaaaand boom goes the dynamite:

http://www.eqclerics.org/forums/showthread.php?t=13927

01-14-2003, 05:50 AM #1
Corish-MT
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Corish-MT

All spells now have a min recast time of 2.2 seconds?
http://lucy.fnord.net/newspells.html...ate=2003-01-14 02:25:32

Changes on the test server this morning... from a cursory glance, it looks like any spell with a recast time of less then 2.2 seconds has been changed to Recast=2.2sec.

And yes, that includes Remedy... and CH...

[Grimjaw]

so ya, i was on the right track. Aparently in classic A LOT of spells had Instant (zero) recast. example: all of clerics heals

that allowed instant recast with clickies. because the only thing holding them back was the GCD.



so lets worry about getting classic mechanics back such as "Recast: Instant / 0" (and not every spell having a minimum recast time of 2.2)

And THEN we can talk about chain casting spells with clickies...


(and in the meantime fix gem slot 1 so clickies wont circumvent 5 minute recast timers)

[Erati]

Originally Posted by Grimjaw [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

(and in the meantime fix gem slot 1 so clickies wont circumvent 5 minute recast timers)

this doesnt happen now - im confused

unless you mean 'graphically' circumventing bc if you put Harvest in slot one and use a clickie - the gem will refresh but the spell will NOT be able to be used instantly

Tech above me hit the ball out of the park - video evidence clearly shows all gems behaving like the 1st spell slot does here and he explained how the mechanic works

its confusing ill admit esp if you dont realize what is happening and would def appear bugged on our server when spells like Harvest or DA pop up instantly in the first spell slot after a clicky - but those are graphical errors not the spell being ready to cast

[Nirgon]

think its 2.5

[Daldaen]

It was 2 (I guess 2.2 but with latency you didn't notice the .2). GoD increased GCD to 2.5

[Technique]

Originally Posted by Grimjaw [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

got a link to the sontalak video?

https://youtu.be/9opZFThy95w?t=18s

Originally Posted by Grimjaw [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

so lets worry about getting classic mechanics back such as "Recast: Instant / 0" (and not every spell having a minimum recast time of 2.2)

I think you're confusing recast and recovery time. They're seperate values, both of which existed during Classic and are working properly here on p99. The recovery time of the last spell cast determines the duration of the "GCD".

Recovery time for most spells is 2.25s, but for some it's longer. For example, Supernova (L49 wiz pbae) has a recovery time of 6s and a recast of 12s. Casting it will grey out all your spell gems for 6s. Using an instant clicky should reset the recovery time on all memmed spells allowing you to cast any of them immediately (assuming they don't have individual recast times).

The inaccuracy on p99 is that doing this doesn't reset the recovery time of the last spell cast unless it's in the 1st slot. Notice in the sontalak video @2:27 that the cleric clicks his jboots and it resets recovery time on all spells, even the heal spell he just cast, while the 8th gem (Divine Aura/Barrier) remains greyed out because it's on recast.

Originally Posted by Grimjaw [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

(and in the meantime fix gem slot 1 so clickies wont circumvent 5 minute recast timers)

They don't. At best you're able to shave the casting time of the spell off its recast time because you can begin casting it before the recast time is up.

[Grimjaw]

Originally Posted by Technique [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Recovery time for most spells is 2.25s

not classic. see my link regarding 2003 patch giving all spells a minimum 2.2 sec recast time when prior to that a lot of spells had zero recast time

i'll stick to using the terms "global cooldown (Recovery?)" and "recast".

Originally Posted by Technique [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

For example, Supernova (L49 wiz pbae) has a recovery time of 6s and a recast of 12s. Casting it will grey out all your spell gems for 6s. Using an instant clicky should reset the recovery time on all memmed spells allowing you to cast any of them immediately (assuming they don't have individual recast times).

Originally Posted by Technique [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The inaccuracy on p99 is that doing this doesn't reset the recovery time of the last spell cast unless it's in the 1st slot.

first you say supernova should be greyed out 12 seconds regardless of clickies, then you go on to say that gem slot 1 is working as intended by popping it up???

the problem is gem slot 1 ignores "recast time of 12s" and pops it out anyways

Originally Posted by Technique [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

that the cleric clicks his jboots and it resets recovery time on all spells, even the heal spell he just cast, while the 8th gem (Divine Aura/Barrier) remains greyed out because it's on recast.

again, under classic mechanics cleric heals had instant recast time. the only thing holding it back should be the global cooldown (recovery?).

Originally Posted by Technique [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

They don't. At best you're able to shave the casting time of the spell off its recast time because you can begin casting it before the recast time is up.

regardless, not classic. therefore gem slot 1 is bugged, and the rest are working fine.


just need to get back on point - removing recast times for spells that didn't have it before the 2003 patch. that would fix nirgons initial complaint.

also gem slot 1 is bugged because a clicky will pop any gem even if its 5 minute recast..

[Erati]

Originally Posted by Grimjaw [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

just need to get back on point - removing recast times for spells that didn't have it before the 2003 patch. that would fix nirgons initial complaint.

also gem slot 1 is bugged because a clicky will pop any gem even if its 5 minute recast..

would love some dev comments about what is possible / what is occuring

[Technique]

Originally Posted by Grimjaw [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

not classic. see my link regarding 2003 patch giving all spells a minimum 2.2 sec recast time when prior to that a lot of spells had zero recast time

Every spell has an individual recovery time that determines the duration of the GCD after casting it. Only certain spells have recast times (e.g., Divine Aura: 15m). These values are present in even the earliest spdats. There's no hard recast time on all spells here on p99.

Originally Posted by Grimjaw [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

first you say supernova should be greyed out 12 seconds regardless of clickies, then you go on to say that gem slot 1 is working as intended by popping it up???

I said any spell that doesn't have a recast time should be refreshed. That obviously excludes Supernova, which has a 12s recast.

Originally Posted by Grimjaw [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

regardless, not classic. therefore gem slot 1 is bugged, and the rest are working fine.

Slot 1 isn't working correctly, that's not being disputed. But the rest simply aren't working at all like they should be (there's even video proof of it) and that's what prompted this thread.

From the eqclerics thread you linked about the newly added recast times:

I admit this could be seen as a bug fix - so we no longer can CH - jboot - CH and skip the recast entirely - but it saddens me nonetheless.

Clicking to skip recast was the only thing that made some fights fun - CH - click - nuke - click - and CH again just time comes to mind

You will still be able to CH-click-Nuke-click-CH
You just wont be able to CH-click-CH

Aside from the first guy sharing your confusion and mistaking recast for recovery, this is more evidence that clickies refreshed all gems (that weren't currently on recast cooldown).

Originally Posted by Grimjaw [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

just need to get back on point - removing recast times for spells that didn't have it before the 2003 patch. that would fix nirgons initial complaint.

These spells already don't have recast times; removing what doesn't exist won't fix anything.

Originally Posted by Grimjaw [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

also gem slot 1 is bugged because a clicky will pop any gem even if its 5 minute recast..

Yes, this is true, yes it shouldn't work like that, but the benefit is negligible because the spell fails to take effect if the cast finishes before its recast time is met.

It sounds like you believe there are perpetually invulnerable clerics/necros and chain harvesting wizards running around the server.