Spells: Spell Caps and Resist on Patch

[slizzy]

This is already meleequest. Everybody has 100+ in almost all resists at high end wth 180-200 MR already so please just delete this entire tread along with all non wizards casters from the game.

P99 red is already all monks, rogues and warriors. Immunity with such low caps and you will force the 5 percent of the population that is non monk/warrior/rogue to either quit or roll the for mentioned classes.

With SoV, everybody will be sporting 150-200 in all resists before buffs with MR capped at 225+. Please tell me how anybody will land anything with such absurdly low immunity caps without lures.

[Colgate]

Originally Posted by slizzy [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This is already meleequest. Everybody has 100+ in almost all resists at high end wth 180-200 MR already so please just delete this entire tread along with all non wizards casters from the game.

P99 red is already all monks, rogues and warriors. Immunity with such low caps and you will force the 5 percent of the population that is non monk/warrior/rogue to either quit or roll the for mentioned classes.

With SoV, everybody will be sporting 150-200 in all resists before buffs with MR capped at 225+. Please tell me how anybody will land anything with such absurdly low immunity caps without lures.

classic everquest dawg

[Colgate]

Originally Posted by Haynar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Maybe 50/70/90.

50 for whirl/stun

70 for blind/mez

90 for root.

H

this sounds pretty good

we need to also make sure certain spells like shock of lightning, chaotic feedback, poison bolt, etc. land a majority of the time in the spirit of classic

[slizzy]

There is classic and there is playable. When literally the top 100+ of the server are BIS or close enough to BIS, you have to rework your classic argument. On a 200-300 pop server, that is totally skewed and should be addressed.

Honestly it's the gear inflation that should force the bell curve of resists much higher then 'classic'. Lets just look at the guilds:
AZ - BIS or near BIS
GW - BIS or near BIS
Holo - If you are 60 you are prob BIS or near BIS

That leaves the new 60's and the up and comers which are in the minority. I'm all for classic but right now the game is totally skewed to melee and spell immunity that is so easily reached doesn't help.

Compound the fact that all non lures are pretty much going to be resisted or do such silly low damage, along with the 1/3 damage already take right off the top.

Will tstaff and windstriker also get the same 90mr to be immune? How is it different to 100-0 someone in a tstaff proc any different then snared/rooted/stun from a caster?

[Technique]

Originally Posted by Haynar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Maybe 50/70/90.

Assuming the current 2x debuffs, Malosini (-120) + Wind of Tish (-80) still wouldn't put a resist-capped player below the immunity threshold for stuns.

[Haynar]

Originally Posted by Technique [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Assuming the current 2x debuffs, Malosini (-120) + Wind of Tish (-80) still wouldn't put a resist-capped player below the immunity threshold for stuns.

Still not sure I see the value of CC type spells in a PvP environment? Is the purpose to ensure a win, and that they cannot fight back? Or to make raids wipe, due to interrupting with an AE stun/mez?

If we cater to everyone having BiS, then what is the point? That was EQs downfall, that it catered almost entirely to the end game.

[slizzy]

I'm just trying to reverse the meleecraft. I spent all of 2 minutes brainstorming how to help casters and some of the below would go a long ways....

--Make tstaff/wind striker resistable like all other cc's based on resists

--drop the 1/3 spell damage penalty

--give a blanket 10-20 percent chance to allow all spells to hit regardless of resist. How is
this different the playing the odds on a tstaff/windstriker proc?

--get rid of the absurd channeling breaks on all melee hits

--fix spells like chaotic feedback and other commonly used classic spells

shammies and chanters are pretty rare in pvp already and having both in small group pvp just doesn't happen. Sure, having both stack is gonna destroy someone.

I don't want this to be CCquest but having such low resists to negate all cc and partial all damage spells just plays into the already lopsided melee meta.

[alaiwy0503]

Originally Posted by Haynar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Still not sure I see the value of CC type spells in a PvP environment? Is the purpose to ensure a win, and that they cannot fight back? Or to make raids wipe, due to interrupting with an AE stun/mez?

If we cater to everyone having BiS, then what is the point? That was EQs downfall, that it catered almost entirely to the end game.

Cc is the #1 most important line to get right in any game with pvp... Period. Being able to lock a high risk player out of a fight is the #1 priority in any pvp situation. Lock the healer out and burn down the threat. Or lock the threat down and burn down the healer(s).

The thing I'm concerned about is that it sounds like we're guessing a lot. "root immunity should be 90, no wait. 100 should be root immunity." do we really have nothing more concrete than a "I remember it on live like this" and another person saying their perception was different?

Edit: most recent mmos address this by doing diminishing returns where a stun lasts full length on first cast then half the time second and half still after that then is immune for a period after that. Eq has no DR so if things aren't right it completely ruins pvp.

[alaiwy0503]

Another concern with people's perceptions are that they are very dependent on what server they played on. For instance. On rallos zek people will remember that people with some of the better gear weren't 100% immune to root etc but that's because people couldn't wear all their gear. So those people will remember what "good gear" was like differently than those from one of the other non item loot servers. People on rz didn't run round in all their gear and therefore the average person resists were much lower. Perceptions are a terrible way to go about this as they will all be based on a jaded version of the truth.

Now fast forward to 2014 when people's perception of "good gear" is based on p1999 and both of the live perceptions are way off because the average level 60 has way better gear here than the average on live because of how long people have been farming things on this server.

[slizzy]

every other mmo doesn't negate caster damage and cc either just because you have great gear.

I fully understand that casters are powerful early in a game and melee take over the end game. It doesn't mean that melee gets to have 100 percent immunity to all spells due to gear either but that is they way it is going to be when 120-140 fr/cr will negate a druid and force a wizards into 400-600pt lures. Once melee start running around with double/triple their current hp, those lures are going to be nothing more then an annoyance.

Dim returns aren't going to happen but at least give the CC a chance to land and not outright immunity at sub 100Mr, the silliest stat to raise. Even crappy geared people can get decent enough MR without being BIS to immune all CC...

AA's helped balance out the PVP for casters A LOT but those aren't going to ever be implemented. I know pre Kunark, it was casterquest but Kunark turned the game into meleequest and SoV double/triples down on melee's. What two classes get the biggest buffs in SoV...monks/sk's.

Toss the casters a bone.