Late game Min/maxing class race list

[Tuffpuppy]

Enjoy dying when your 6 second torpor cast gets interrupted.

[Orruar]

Originally Posted by Tuffpuppy [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Enjoy dying when your 6 second torpor cast gets interrupted.

If a shaman dies because he had a single interrupt on torpor, they probably shouldn't bother with the CR and instead just reroll as a wizard.

[Orruar]

Originally Posted by Bill Tetley [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

played an ogre war for years on live and now I play a damn woodelf here for the last year and a half. I see no difference what so ever with frontal stun immunity being gone and kick seems to land just as much as slam did... dps? I parse the same as any ogre warrior in similar gear. /shrug 6% difference? doubtful

6% was probably calculated based on unslowed/unslowable mobs like raid bosses. On anything slowed, the most you'd ever be stunned is like 4% of the time, and that's only if the mob lands 100% of bashes and never decides to kick. So yeah, on random trash that is often missing/kicking/slowed, it's probably like 1%.

[khanable]

Originally Posted by Orruar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

6% was probably calculated based on unslowed/unslowable mobs like raid bosses. On anything slowed, the most you'd ever be stunned is like 4% of the time, and that's only if the mob lands 100% of bashes and never decides to kick. So yeah, on random trash that is often missing/kicking/slowed, it's probably like 1%.

The point is getting those slows and roots off when you have 5-6 mobs on you

Ogre removes an element of randomness (stun) if you're facing the mob.

In terms of min/max, that's huge!

[Orruar]

Originally Posted by khanable [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The point is getting those slows and roots off when you have 5-6 mobs on you

Ogre removes an element of randomness (stun) if you're facing the mob.

In terms of min/max, that's huge!

If you're a min/maxxer, you're unlikely to put yourself in the situation where you have 5-6 mobs on you. And even if you are in that situation, you're likely the type to have plenty of root nets to lock things down. How many shamans solo HS south these days? I did it for a long time and never saw any others except maybe Svenn (another barb). Where are all these amazingly powerful ogre shamans?

[khanable]

Originally Posted by Orruar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If you're a min/maxxer, you're unlikely to put yourself in the situation where you have 5-6 mobs on you. And even if you are in that situation, you're likely the type to have plenty of root nets to lock things down. How many shamans solo HS south these days? I did it for a long time and never saw any others except maybe Svenn (another barb). Where are all these amazingly powerful ogre shamans?

Someone already mentioned it in this thread but:

player skill and situational awareness will always trump racial abilities

we're talking pure min/max for a specific classes' function

which now that I think about it, all shamans are good for are sta/dex/talis and sow, ammirite?

iksar/troll all day!

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[Yumyums Inmahtumtums]

Originally Posted by Orruar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

6% was probably calculated based on unslowed/unslowable mobs like raid bosses. On anything slowed, the most you'd ever be stunned is like 4% of the time, and that's only if the mob lands 100% of bashes and never decides to kick. So yeah, on random trash that is often missing/kicking/slowed, it's probably like 1%.

Pretty sure people aren't worried about whether they're getting interrupted during canni.

It's whether you get interrupted during slow/torpor that counts.

[Raev]

So here is the argument for Iksar warriors over Ogres: if you are tanking something in Velious, are you more likely to a) die or b) lose aggro? My experience on Velious beta says A. CH aggro is almost nothing, Monks FD, Rogues Evade, Wizards cast concussion, etc. Of course, if you are tanking ToV east trash for slow, then yeah it might matter . . . or you could just have a Paladin tank. Also, I don't think the Iksar racial AC bonus is all that amazing. Remember, you'll be using Defensive most of the time which effectively cuts AC effectiveness in half.

The real TL;DR here is that the OP's question is pretty pointless for most class/race combinations. I would say Ogre Shadowknight and Iksar Necromancer have a small advantage over the other SK/necro choices, Ogre Shaman and Iksar Monk have a tiny advantage, and nothing else really matters.

I mean when you combine the BoTB and the Solo Artist challenge, it's pretty clear that player skill >> race/class combinations.

[Belleraphone]

Hey guys I appreciate your help but I'm well aware of the fact that player skill is better than racial abilities. I am just interested in min maxing though and want the best race for any new characters I start, that's all.

[Orruar]

Originally Posted by Belleraphone [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Hey guys I appreciate your help but I'm well aware of the fact that player skill is better than racial abilities. I am just interested in min maxing though and want the best race for any new characters I start, that's all.

That's my point. For any moderately aware shaman, troll > ogre. And most min/maxers are interested in maxing their playstyle in addition to maxing the toon they have. So troll is the best min/max race for shaman. Ogre is the best race for poorly played shaman.