Spells: 100 MR to resist MR nuke. 350 FR to reduce FR nuke.

[R Flair]

Sounds like it hits any buff where dispel counter >= spell counter. Skips what it can't hit and comes back and deducts counters from stronger buffs if it couldn't 1 shot a spell.

Think they should just increase buff and dot counters and be done with it. Maybe not perfect by way closer to how it was.

[Haynar]

Originally Posted by R Flair [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Sounds like it hits any buff where dispel counter >= spell counter. Skips what it can't hit and comes back and deducts counters from stronger buffs if it couldn't 1 shot a spell.

Think they should just increase buff and dot counters and be done with it. Maybe not perfect by way closer to how it was.

There are no buff counters to apply to. This theoretical parameter to apply against does not exist. This is not trivial to figure out.

H

[Haynar]

Nake dispelling is the need. Add MR to see the impact. Do a variety of spells, assign buff strengths based on level of spell and/effect. Figure out how save chances work vs MR.

Oh ya, and thats a lot of work. Possible? If mechanics still exist on eqlive, then i can reproduce it probably.

H

[Dullah]

We have a couple people in Nihilum trying to log on to live servers to test dispel counters, though the system was largely changed around 2002-2004. Old posts about MR involved in dispels sound like someone was jumping to conclusions. Reading through all these old dispel related threads reveals most players didn't understand the concept of counters, especially as they applied to dispels, and this led to several weird theories including the involvement of MR.

ONLY REMOVES ONE, By Ahappysk (1/28/2001)

This spell actually only removes a maximum of one (de)buff at a time. Also, it"s not guaranteed that a spell will be removed with each cast; if a debuff was cast by a very high level character or NPC it may take a few casts of this to break it. Robe casters get higher level versions of this that have a better chance of removing one or more effects (Enchanters" Pillage Enchantment being the ultimate spell in this line, IIRC). Finally, always remember that this spell IS considered an offensive spell by NPCs, and they"ll react to it as though you"d attacked them directly. Not sure how town guards react if you cast it on a group member (you must be grouped to cast it on a PC unless you"re PvP or duelling).

http://web.archive.org/web/200203050...ll.asp?Id=1368

I believe they were mistaken about the level of the entity being a factor in the counters rather than the level of the spell itself. High lvl npcs/pcs don't generally cast lower level spells and this isn't the way counters worked with poison/disease.

[Haynar]

Originally Posted by Dullah [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

We have a couple people in Nihilum trying to log on to live servers to test dispel counters, though the system was largely changed around 2002-2004. Old posts about MR involved in dispels sound like someone was jumping to conclusions. Reading through all these old dispel related threads reveals most players didn't understand the concept of counters, especially as they applied to dispels, and this led to several weird theories including the involvement of MR.



http://web.archive.org/web/200203050...ll.asp?Id=1368

I believe they were mistaken about the level of the entity being a factor in the counters rather than the level of the spell itself. High lvl npcs/pcs don't generally cast lower level spells and this isn't the way counters worked with poison/disease.

Prove to me level does or does not come in to play.

Prove to me what does.

At this point I have concluded there are some mechanics at play that we do not fully understand. And I will probably need to spend 10-20 hrs on my own to figure out.

Will it be fixed soon? Not likely.

H

[Dullah]

Ya I'm testing it right now on live.

Will post logs, but seeing a lot of randomness. I'll do whatever I can to help, but I'm not sure at this point what can be proven using a version of EQ thats 13 years older than the one we're trying to emulate.

So far I'm seeing cancel magic take anywhere from 1-4 casts to remove an Aegolism casted by a level 85 cleric. Heroism takes 1-3 cancel magics to remove. I'm going to give heroic bond to a low level and see if its harder to remove a high level characters buff casting low level dispels.

The only thing I can see for certain is Annul magic 2x(9) takes top 2 slots every time.

[Technique]

Originally Posted by Dullah [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

So far I'm seeing cancel magic take anywhere from 1-4 casts to remove an Aegolism casted by a level 85 cleric. Heroism takes 1-3 cancel magics to remove.

Too soon to call it anything more than a coincidence, but aegolism has 4 effect slots and heroism/heroic bond only 3.

Try cancel magic/nullify vs. manaskin (6 slots) and manasink (1 slot) if those are available to you.

[Haynar]

I am thinking there are values based on the effects a spell has. Not always easy to look up. I will try to push my spell parser i use to git, so i can give it out. I did a version for dalaya, but this one is more for titanium. Big issue is the spell icons dont match.

H

[Haynar]

Can also test on an ac only buff. Or shaman hos, which has no ac.

There are multiple combinations can try, to see if each effect has a value? Or if they are cumulative. Whatever.

H

[Haynar]

Thanks for all the people who have been posting actual data on how cancel magic spells currently work on eqlive. How they take out different buffs. Etc.

Oh ya, those who keep saying fix it, but do nothing ... YOU SUCK.

At about 40% figured out so far. Will have it working perfect in a day or two I estimate.

H