Best 4 person all caster/priest group

[cyxthryth]

Originally Posted by cyxthryth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I want the data of why you think I am a troll. Please provide the relevant/requested data since you are seemingly very concerned with providing data, as you continue to copy/paste it. This may also clear up some confusion from earlier in the thread: you believe you are providing the requested data - but you aren't. Please provide data of my trolling, or please provide data of your Shaman DPSing in a high level fast-paced killing DPS group, as you have yet to post either of these particular data points for we people who want the data.

[PlsNoBan]

All data that disagrees with me is fake news

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by PlsNoBan [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

All data that disagrees with me is fake news

At least you finally admit it! Thanks for being honest.

[cyxthryth]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

At least you finally admit it! Thanks for being honest.

Neither of which you can do, apparently. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Originally Posted by cyxthryth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I want the data of why you think I am a troll. Please provide the relevant/requested data since you are seemingly very concerned with providing data, as you continue to copy/paste it. This may also clear up some confusion from earlier in the thread: you believe you are providing the requested data - but you aren't. Please provide data of my trolling, or please provide data of your Shaman DPSing in a high level fast-paced killing DPS group, as you have yet to post either of these particular data points for we people who want the data.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by cyxthryth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Neither of which you can do, apparently. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'll happily admit I am wrong if people bring data instead of trolling. You could do that at any time.

[cyxthryth]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'll happily admit I am wrong if people bring data instead of trolling. You could do that at any time.

No. You are wrong about me trolling. I am only stating facts and asking questions, as has been stated to you multiple times. I cannot help how you feel about it.

You can provide the requested data/evidence at any time. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Originally Posted by cyxthryth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I want the data of why you think I am a troll. Please provide the relevant/requested data since you are seemingly very concerned with providing data, as you continue to copy/paste it. This may also clear up some confusion from earlier in the thread: you believe you are providing the requested data - but you aren't. Please provide data of my trolling, or please provide data of your Shaman DPSing in a high level fast-paced killing DPS group, as you have yet to post either of these particular data points for we people who want the data.

[Vexenu]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Mana-wise the Mage is far worse off, they will not be nuking at all after a few more mobs. Once the Mage has drained their mana pool, they can only nuke every 84 seconds because they can only regenerate 200 mana per minute. The test was not using C2. The Shaman can easily keep their mana up due to breaks in mobs, mobs that die a bit slower, etc. Remember I am testing under the assumption that the group is fighting a mob every 36 seconds without break, which is honestly unrealistic.

Also remember this is making the assumption your group is fighting mobs that die in only 36 seconds. A Shaman's DPS increases when a Mob takes longer to die, while a Mage is still bound by their mana.

Why do you keep saying that the Mage DPS bound by mana? I've pointed out repeatedly in this thread that the Mage can output enormous DPS indefinitely with just the pet and clickies. With Velious quest armor pants and robe the Mage doesn't even have to expend mana on pet haste and DS. Boots of Bladecalling alone are 35 DPS, and are a fair gear assumption when comparing against a raid-geared Torpor Shaman.

You're also terribly underestimating just how much stronger the Mage pet is compared to the dinky Shaman pet. Shaman pet is level 39, can't backstab and can't quad. Mage pet is level 49 (with water staff), quads, backstabs for 200 and procs a nuke for over 100. A reliably backstabbing, focused 60 water pet by itself is a DPS chainsaw exceeded only by high-end Velious-geared Rogues and Monks. The Shaman pet will also only be hasted to 50% with Celerity, vs. the Mage pet hasted to 65% with Burnout IV and an additional 11% from Muzzle. The DPS difference between the two pets is night and day, which is to be expected considering the class is built entirely around the pet.

Finally, the Mage does not care how long or short the fight is. As long the fight is sufficient duration to get off a single clickie nuke (17 sec for boots) then the DPS is the same, whether the fight is 17 seconds long or 17,000.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Vexenu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Why do you keep saying that the Mage DPS bound by mana? I've pointed out repeatedly in this thread that the Mage can output enormous DPS indefinitely with just the pet and clickies. With Velious quest armor pants and robe the Mage doesn't even have to expend mana on pet haste and DS. Boots of Bladecalling alone are 35 DPS, and are a fair gear assumption when comparing against a raid-geared Torpor Shaman.

You're also terribly underestimating just how much stronger the Mage pet is compared to the dinky Shaman pet. Shaman pet is level 39, can't backstab and can't quad. Mage pet is level 49 (with water staff), quads, backstabs for 200 and procs a nuke for over 100. A reliably backstabbing, focused 60 water pet by itself is a DPS chainsaw exceeded only by high-end Velious-geared Rogues and Monks. The Shaman pet will also only be hasted to 50% with Celerity, vs. the Mage pet hasted to 65% with Burnout IV and an additional 11% from Muzzle. The DPS difference between the two pets is night and day, which is to be expected considering the class is built entirely around the pet.

Finally, the Mage does not care how long or short the fight is. As long the fight is sufficient duration to get off a single clickie nuke (17 sec for boots) then the DPS is the same, whether the fight is 17 seconds long or 17,000.

"Why do you keep saying that the Mage DPS bound by mana?" The reason is simple. Troxx asked for a parse without clickies lol.

The mage does care about fight length, because that depends how often they can nuke, both with and without clickies.

Let's talk about clickies:

Boots of the Bladecaller can only be clicked once if the mob is dying in less than 34 seconds. If the mobs are dying in 30 seconds, JBB has a DPS of 26, while Boots of the Bladecaller only has 20 DPS. If you want to use Burnt Wood Staff, that is 22 DPS. So a Shaman can out-clickie a Mage in a shorter fight.

A mage is doing 56 (Pet) + 22 (Burnt Wood Staff) + 4 (DS) = 82 DPS on a single target if all they do is spam clickies in 30 second fights.

A Shaman is doing 26 (JBB) + 18 (Pet) = 44 DPS on a single target if all they do is spam clickies in 30 second fights.

If a Shaman needs to increase DPS more, they could do a single cast of Winters Roar after the clickies (JBB is 24 seconds, Winters roar is 4 seconds for a total of 28) to increase their DPS by 9, so it would go back to roughly 52 DPS. The gap is still around 30 DPS, and the group would need to chain pull 20 mobs back to back for the Shaman to run out of mana. That is not really possible in Crypt or a lot of other higher level areas.

And remember, if your group is able to chain pull and kill mobs in Sebilis, the Shaman can also root/rot with Epic. A Shaman can Single Bane + Epic DoT 2 mobs for 68 DPS while the group is churning through other mobs. With pet that puts them up to 84 DPS. If a group can chain pull that many mobs back to back, there are plenty to root/rot hehe. The mana cost for that would be 1050 mana, and a Shaman can get that back in roughly 70 seconds. The group can then finish the rooted mobs off as they get around to it, or let the Shaman continue to DPS independently and kill them that way. If you really wanted efficiency in a group, you wouldn't simply chain pull single mobs. You could kill multiple mobs at the same time instead, but a Mage can't really do that since they are basically a single target damage class.

[PlsNoBan]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

"Why do you keep saying that the Mage DPS bound by mana?" The reason is simple. Troxx asked for a parse without clickies lol.

The mage does care about fight length, because that depends how often they can nuke, both with and without clickies.

Let's talk about clickies:

Boots of the Bladecaller can only be clicked once if the mob is dying in less than 34 seconds. If the mobs are dying in 30 seconds, JBB has a DPS of 26, while Boots of the Bladecaller only has 20 DPS. If you want to use Burnt Wood Staff, that is 22 DPS. So a Shaman can out-clickie a Mage in a shorter fight.

A mage is doing 56 (Pet) + 22 (Burnt Wood Staff) + 4 (DS) = 82 DPS on a single target if all they do is spam clickies in 30 second fights.

A Shaman is doing 26 (JBB) + 18 (Pet) = 44 DPS on a single target if all they do is spam clickies in 30 second fights.

If a Shaman needs to increase DPS more, they could do a single cast of Winters Roar after the clickies (JBB is 24 seconds, Winters roar is 4 seconds for a total of 28) to increase their DPS by 9, so it would go back to roughly 52 DPS. The gap is still around 30 DPS, and the group would need to chain pull 20 mobs back to back for the Shaman to run out of mana. That is not really possible in Crypt or a lot of other higher level areas.

And remember, if your group is able to chain pull and kill mobs in Sebilis, the Shaman can also root/rot with Epic. A Shaman can Single Bane + Epic DoT 2 mobs for 68 DPS while the group is churning through other mobs. With pet that puts them up to 84 DPS. If a group can chain pull that many mobs back to back, there are plenty to root/rot hehe. The mana cost for that would be 1050 mana, and a Shaman can get that back in roughly 70 seconds. The group can then finish the rooted mobs off as they get around to it, or let the Shaman continue to DPS independently and kill them that way. If you really wanted efficiency in a group, you wouldn't simply chain pull single mobs. You could kill multiple mobs at the same time instead, but a Mage can't really do that since they are basically a single target damage class.

I think ur erection for the shaman class has persisted for more than 4 hours. Time to call a doctor.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by PlsNoBan [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think ur erection for the shaman class has persisted for more than 4 hours. Time to call a doctor.

It's just facts. Sorry you haven't brought any.