Blade of Carnage drop on beta

[Nirgon]

We had CH rotations and tanks wearing full Warlord and would get dropped by Yelinak at times on live

I'm totally on board with AoW/Tunare being a perfect reason for mob ac / damage getting a revisit

Then again, we DID have 130 people including tons of ragebringer'd rogues. I saw the tanks get absolutely f'ing pancaked even during defensive, I think only 1 survived his whole disc.

bur kek etc

[koros]

Originally Posted by Nirgon [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

We had CH rotations and tanks wearing full Warlord and would get dropped by Yelinak at times on live

I'm totally on board with AoW/Tunare being a perfect reason for mob ac / damage getting a revisit

Then again, we DID have 130 people including tons of ragebringer'd rogues. I saw the tanks get absolutely f'ing pancaked even during defensive, I think only 1 survived his whole disc.

bur kek etc

Your clerics were lagging, or had a shitty CH chain... Yelinak hit for 100 DB, 25 DI it looks like. He did a max 350 a hit to a defensive warrior. The math doesn't lie. Ch chains aren't perfect and you're bound to get warriors dropping. Sometimes. But let's not pretend that there's something wrong with every single one of these mobs being killable with < 72 on day one. If they want to tune them to have just insane atk/ac go ahead, but let's not pretend it's classic.

Mobs didn't have insane AC until Luclin, and even then I was doing 60-80 dps to Arch Lich first few weeks of the expansion as a rogue.

[Treats]

It doesnt matter, it was done with full kunark gear on fresh beta copies, no clickies, no velious spells/buffs, no boxing, no joint raids with others, no visitors and no help what so ever. With a new guild who has never raided together.

To me 47% looked absolutely fantastic with that in mind, a legitimate first day 47% possible is testament to the best team of clerics I've ever played with.

Something might be wrong

[LostCause]

ive seen AoW go down to 64% with 37 7-9 were clerics
decent deeps and that was without any velious gear.
anyone who thinks you need a zerg to kill AoW is dumb.


back on live kunark was out less then a year so i highly doubt anyone was even BIS kunark gear when velious released
doubt they zerged it down with BIS velious gear either.

[Treats]

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They absolutely zerged him.

They couldn't tank Avatar of War with NToV shit and didn't UNTIL RIGHT BEFORE THE NEXT FUCKING EXPANSION.

It boggles my mind how some of you think he could be killable in BiS Kunark gear.

They were probably just bads that had no clue what they were doing I guess.

[Raev]

Originally Posted by Treats [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It boggles my mind how some of you think he could be killable in BiS Kunark gear.

The Avatar of War has a max hit of 704 against a defensive warrior. If he got unbelievably incredibly lucky, and got 8 attack rounds with 8 hits and 8 max hits, he would still not 1-round a tank with 5617 HP. Kunark tanks are damn close to this right now.

Guilds had trouble tanking him in Velious because of their shitty internet connections. If your CH chain gets lagged out for 1s (easy to do in 2000) and he gets 2-3 attack rounds in, your tank is going to die.

I personally would like to see AoW buffed a bit compared to his beta stats, but the reality is if his stats are anything close to classic he's going to die on day one to a 200 man zerg.

You really need to accept the fact that we have better GUIs, better internet connections, and more experience at this game than people did in 2000 and let go of the butthurt.

[Treats]

Originally Posted by Raev [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Guilds had trouble tanking him in Velious because of their shitty internet connections. If your CH chain gets lagged out for 1s (easy to do in 2000) and he gets 2-3 attack rounds in, your tank is going to die.

I personally would like to see AoW buffed a bit compared to his beta stats, but the reality is if his stats are anything close to classic he's going to die on day one to a 200 man zerg.

You really need to accept the fact that we have better GUIs, better internet connections, and more experience at this game than people did in 2000 and let go of the butthurt.

Please tell me, in what game do you take the BiS gear from a previous expansion and go straight to the bosses of the next expansion and kill them on day fucking 1?

The developers at Verant/Sony would have been fired if this ever happened (some of them were anyway).

They must of had connections strung with wire and duct tape at their offices during their pre-beta testing, thats why they couldn't kill AoW with their BiS Kunark gears!!

Yes, you have more experience on P1999, however that is not experience from an actual Verant server.

GTFO with the butthurt, sorry I side with the NPC's more than the Players.

[Raev]

Originally Posted by Treats [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Please tell me, in what game do you take the BiS gear from a previous expansion and go straight to the bosses of the next expansion and kill them on day fucking 1?

Our situation here is a somewhat unique because we have prior knowledge of the expansion.

Originally Posted by Treats

GTFO with the butthurt, sorry I side with the NPC's more than the Players.

I don't know how else to describe your emotional appeals to the intentions of Verant's developers rather than the actual mechanics they created.

[Tankdan]

Originally Posted by Treats [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Please tell me, in what game do you take the BiS gear from a previous expansion and go straight to the bosses of the next expansion and kill them on day fucking 1?

The developers at Verant/Sony would have been fired if this ever happened (some of them were anyway).

They must of had connections strung with wire and duct tape at their offices during their pre-beta testing, thats why they couldn't kill AoW with their BiS Kunark gears!!

Yes, you have more experience on P1999, however that is not experience from an actual Verant server.

GTFO with the butthurt, sorry I side with the NPC's more than the Players.

You're giving EQ mobs way too much credit. And the AoW kill on beta people were getting AOE rezzed, it DID rek the tanks. It was a wipe by all means. If 140 epic'd people cant zerge it in the unthinkable gear they had, you cannot sit here and say its undertuned. His max hits are well known, his HP is known, after that it is a mana and numbers game.

We're playing a whole different EQ right now. Raids have 80 reapers, 30+ soullfires, 20+ charged mallets to hand out, and all kinds of tricks up their sleeve. No, it is not that hard. Yes it was hard back in the day because people were a lot less hardcore than they are now. No guild on EQClassic even comes close to the effort / time / dedication needed to raid Class C on P99. Who cares what some guild did or didn't do in 2000, I don't. I just want accurate numbers reflected. It wasn't meant to be harder.

[koros]

Originally Posted by Treats [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

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They absolutely zerged him.

They couldn't tank Avatar of War with NToV shit and didn't UNTIL RIGHT BEFORE THE NEXT FUCKING EXPANSION.

It boggles my mind how some of you think he could be killable in BiS Kunark gear.

They were probably just bads that had no clue what they were doing I guess.

What exactly are you trying to show with those links? Because you seem to be arguing against your own point. Those are from july 2001. During which time, Legacy of Steel had absolutely 0 NToV loot, and they still got AoW that low. You guys can poke holes in our "theorycrafting" all you want, but math is math and eq is a game of basic math and statistics. Especially on a mob that attacks one target every 1.8 (is that right here?) seconds for less than their max hitpoints.