Wizard, when do they turn the corner?

[Stonewallx39]

What types of groups would burst dps have application?

At 39 a Wizard can nuke 400ish a pop. That's 25% of a lot of mid 30 mobs total hp. Is it just that mana regains to slowly in a faster paced group to be sustained?

[Sage Truthbearer]

As others said.. Wizards specialize in in doing a lot of damage in a short period of time. Take their damage output over a long period of time and it starts to look pretty shitty.

This is pretty easy to test. Add up all the damage a Wizard would do over 1 hour in a group and compare it to a Rogue, Monk, or Mage and you will see how laughably bad it is. Trust me dude, I'm a Paladin. I know about poor DPS.

[Morningbreath]

Originally Posted by Stonewallx39 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

What types of groups would burst dps have application?

At 39 a Wizard can nuke 400ish a pop. That's 25% of a lot of mid 30 mobs total hp. Is it just that mana regains to slowly in a faster paced group to be sustained?

Correct. It's actually made worse by having an enchanter in the group because they're hasting the melee which grants a much higher damage increase compared to Clarity on a wizard.

The shortest solution would have been to give wizards a scaling, magical version of backstab with a similar cooldown duration.

[Sage Truthbearer]

Originally Posted by Morningbreath [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The shortest solution would have been to give wizards a scaling, magical version of backstab with a similar cooldown duration.

Every class has their strengths and weaknesses, the solution is not to make every class godmode but to pick a class that best fits how YOU like to have fun in EQ. Wizards are awesome in many areas of the game it's just that traditional xp groups are not where they shine.

[mgellan]

Originally Posted by Stonewallx39 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

What types of groups would burst dps have application?

At 39 a Wizard can nuke 400ish a pop. That's 25% of a lot of mid 30 mobs total hp. Is it just that mana regains to slowly in a faster paced group to be sustained?

Yeah in a group unless you really don't nuke all that much you end up medding to 300-400, stand, nuke, sit. Skip a mob or two. Rinse and repeat. And you can't cc with no mana so keep a buffer just in case [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] Evac? Keep another mana buffer or OOM.

Wizzies are monster raid animals, and porters. Levelling wise you can get a bard PL to 50s once you get an AOE, quadding, and then Chardok. I don't think I've ever been invited into a group on my now 57 wizard where it wasn't guildies giving him a pity spot LOL [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] But if you recognize thats what they are, they're a fun class, especially mobility wise.

Regards,
Mg

[Daldaen]

Mana regeneration is the issue.

They can blow up mobs, but are then out of commission for several more mobs while they med.

Their primary strength, is on an over pull, that may wipe the group, they can help CC with Stun and root and snare, then blow all their mana killing off 1-2 mobs quickly to minimize the chaos of the pull.

After doing that they med and do nothing else for the next 5-10 min.

[Cillaz]

Raids! And ports!
Not so good for xp groups, but can solo easily, port and once you raid they are massive dps and a must have!

[Stonewallx39]

I like the idea of being able to do some cc in groups and dps like crazy over a short period of time. What is it about raiding that really let's a Wizard shine?

[Lojik]

Originally Posted by Stonewallx39 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I like the idea of being able to do some cc in groups and dps like crazy over a short period of time. What is it about raiding that really let's a Wizard shine?

When you're in an xp group, you're trying to do as much damage over a sustained period...think of it as trying to run a marathon. A wizard is more of a sprinter, they can sprint really fast for like 100 yards, but if they're doing a marathon they have to crawl the rest of the way. Kunark and old world raid mobs are more like sprints with low hp levels, but some raid mobs in velious are again more like marathons and wizards kinda fall behind. Although bane nukes can offset this a bit.

Also on this server gear is really easy to come by, and even an untwinked melee will have weapons that a player on live with equivalent playtime would gawk at. My warrior on live was dual wielding langseax until level 20 (6/23 1hs) I don't think I've seen a single one on this server. This has also helped to relegate wizards to the least wanted class in xp groups.

[Raev]

The sad truth is that Wizards aren't even good burst damage in XP groups 50+. A Warrior tank has no chance to keep a mob off a chain nuking wizard, so for starters you are relegated groups with Paladin or Shadowknight tanks. Even with a suitably on-the-ball hybrid tank, a wizard with 2000 mana available can only cast Ice Comet 5x. Thats 5500 damage assuming no resists . . . which is maybe 2/3 of the HP of a Krup Knight. If your puller fucks up and brings all 5 chef mobs, it will be the Enchanter/Bard locking them all down with mez who saves your ass, not the Wizard.

If you are just dying to beat your head against the wall and play an XP Wizard, you should abandon the idea of burst damage and instead play to their real strengths: porting and stuns. Porting is nearly self explanatory: when you get a cleric rep from two continents over your group will breathe a sigh of relief. Stuns are also tremendously valuable. Stun Wizard mobs when they are about to nuke your tank for 1100+. Stun cleric/shaman mobs before they chain heal themselves for 50% of their bar. Consistently stun charmed pets and Enchanters will love you.

This advice basically follows Loraen's 12th Rule of EverQuest: a class becomes better the closer they play to an Enchanter (who can do all of the above much better than a Wizard). So can a cleric. Which is why Wizards are not good in XP groups.