Taken - Sev

[dustysr06]

Has taken been raid suspended ever?...

[Argh]

A warning and not a suspension is in line with former first offense FTE punishment.

[arsenalpow]

Originally Posted by Argh [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

A warning and not a suspension is in line with former first offense FTE punishment.

Where was BDA's warning for killing 10% of a Nagafen?

[Hitpoint]

Originally Posted by arsenalpow [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Where was BDA's warning for killing 10% of a Nagafen?

He was over 30%. They were wiping clearly. Had Naggy been 10% he would have been running and jumping in would not have been necessary.

I think all guilds should be past the point of warnings for this. Too many suspensions have been handed out already for not respecting FTE shouts. Even class R guilds should have leaders who are aware of the current rules and who can make correct decisions, especially if they want to compete for FFA spawns.

[doyoueventrainbro]

Why does Catherin get to skate again?

She gets caught auto-firing and doesn't get banned. Third party software is like the BIGGEST NONO on this fucking server.

He directs her guild to kill a mob they do not have FTE on, and they get a warning.

So, two of the biggest NONOs on this server, two things that will get a person or guild suspended / banned, are being overlooked.

Why is Catherin allowed to do whatever the fuck it wants?

[Rais]

I think it's pretty clear by now that Lostprofits is really Catherine and never left Taken. He finished his GED and added a voice changer to keep his guild. I can understand playing dumb not to get your guild suspended. Yet doing shit over and over with the same person in the leadership role shows there is an issue with this person, and the simple concept of following rules.

[doyoueventrainbro]

Sirken clearly states that IF YOU DON'T HAVE FTE, DON'T FUCKING KILL IT.

Stand by your own statements.

[Signal]

Not to cause a stir with you Chest just to clarify. I think the problem with that Nagafen was 2 guilds participated in killing it while having 2 trackers on the spawn to engage it each. It essentially let BDA and Taken use 4 trackers and 2 guilds to engage a Dragon with and kill it while every other guild was restricted to 2 each ? Feel free to correct me if I am wrong but that to me seemed like the bigger infraction on that Nagafen.

Not saying it was a worked out plan between the 2 guilds to work together killing it. However, the moment you decided to engage to help them finish killing it you essentially made it 1 raid force with 4 trackers there.

[arsenalpow]

Originally Posted by Signal [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Not to cause a stir with you Chest just to clarify. I think the problem with that Nagafen was 2 guilds participated in killing it while having 2 trackers on the spawn to engage it each. It essentially let BDA and Taken use 4 trackers and 2 guilds to engage a Dragon with and kill it while every other guild was restricted to 2 each ? Feel free to correct me if I am wrong but that to me seemed like the bigger infraction on that Nagafen.

Not saying it was a worked out plan between the 2 guilds to work together killing it. However, the moment you decided to engage to help them finish killing it you essentially made it 1 raid force with 4 trackers there.

There was no prior discussion to work together on that kill. If we were working together we would have engaged alongside them from the start. The entire situation was a hypothetical. Taken might have wiped and TMO might have picked up FTE after but BDA jumped in for the last percentages of the kill and now we're class R suspended for an FFA mob. Additionally i don't even remember where our trackers were for that engage, they might have been at the zoneline. I didn't see any fraps or screenshots which seems to be the default requirement for these situations.

This isn't the point though. The point is there have been multiple instances where guilds have been suspended for killing something that wasn't their FTE, which happens to be the current situation. Who was or wasn't on the encounter log is irrelevant. The entire zone knew the FTE was bogus, anyone on that encounter log should have bailed out ASAP to get a fresh reset, instead Taken killed it. They didn't accidentally kill it, it was voluntary and calculated. Intent means something.

[Hitpoint]

Originally Posted by arsenalpow [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

That's my issue, consistency. I was on vacation when Sadad got dragged to the table by Derubael and TMO over an issue that was nearly 90 days old that Sirken personally told me was squashed. We engaged a FFA Naggy at 10% when Taken had FTE. Taken wasn't likely to wipe and one of our officers made the call to get some hits in. Unbrella demanded a Nagafen because Taken could have wiped thus preventing a TMO engage. Derubael decided an appropriate punishment was to leverage the class R rotation slot we have for Naggy into being skipped the next time up. I fully disagreed with the punishment on multiple levels.

Taken killing Sev was so much more blatant. I'm fucking shocked that the staff made this ruling with multiple incidences of precedence that have already been resolved. It's not consistent at all. Why should BDA lose a class R target over an FFA encounter and Taken gets a warning? What's the logical precedence to determine that? If the answer is "because the staff said so" then expect this type of fallout every fucking time because when the staff isn't consistent there will be questions and cries of favoritism.

After a two (or was it three?) month old petition was finally examined and ruled on, Tmo got banned from VP for a week and our loot was deleted from 4 legitimate kills on the previous VP. Essentially losing loot off 4 kills that we worked for, and potentially 6 more dragons the next week. When our competition essentially did the same thing two weeks later that got us suspended, they had to forfeit a single Druushk to us.

Rulings here may never be consistent. And I wish that wasn't the case. But the only thing we can take away from it is that guild negotiations need to happen, they need to be fair and reasonable, and we can't let issues be brought to the GMs. This is what the staff wants. If one guild comes to another with a reasonable grievance, dropping a pull, or forfeiting a spawn, or giving up the loot, needs to be something all guilds are open to. Letting grudges and fucking retarded politics bullshit come in the way of player negotiations, is in nobody's best interest. And it seems like this happens more often than not.

Also, I don't know who informed you, but that Naggy was at 30%, had not dropped in health for a long time, and the last handful of people were being summoned and killed. I watched the whole thing, probably even had fraps of it at some point.