Need to complain

[fastboy21]

Originally Posted by melkortshea [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Here is some interesting information regarding the comments that suggest the military is mostly formed of the poor and lower ranks of society.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion...ier-edit_x.htm

According to a comprehensive study of all enlistees for the years 1998-99 and 2003 that The Heritage Foundation just released, the typical recruit in the all-volunteer force is wealthier, more educated and more rural than the average 18- to 24-year-old citizen is. Indeed, for every two recruits coming from the poorest neighborhoods, there are three recruits coming from the richest neighborhoods

If, for example, we consider the education of every recruit, 98% joined with high-school diplomas or better. By comparison, 75% of the general population meets that standard. Among all three-digit ZIP code areas in the USA in 2003 (one can study larger areas by isolating just the first three digits of ZIP codes), not one had a higher graduation rate among civilians than among its recruits.

In fact, since the 9/11 attacks, more volunteers have emerged from the middle and upper classes and fewer from the lowest-income groups. In 1999, both the highest fifth of the nation in income and the lowest fifth were slightly underrepresented among military volunteers. Since 2001, enlistments have increased in the top two-fifths of income levels but have decreased among the lowest fifth.

You said it yourself, this data is anomalous of the norm due to 9/11...in times of war you are going to get a very different demographic then during peacetime in the military. that is obvious, and is reflected in the study you describe.

My comments don't reflect badly on the people that I served with. As someone else pointed out most of the "thugs" and "borderline criminals" actually made VERY good soldiers. In fact, even the kids I went through basic with who weren't educated (I already had a masters degree and was with some 18 year olds that could barely do math), for the most part, turned out to be quite intelligent. At least, in the sense of multiple intelligences not all being about formal education...and were again, in the end, very good soldiers.

Its a reality in most industrialized countries, including the US, that the military is not seen as a respectable career to enter unless you 1) an officer or 2) have no other options. I'm not necessarily happy with this, but I do believe there is some truth to it...how many parents encourage their kids to become enlisted men if they have the option to go to college or professional school?

In the end, I enlisted because I thought it was something I had to do if I really believe in the things I think about patriotism etc...but I don't think I am the rule by any means.

[Malinrol]

I have an opinion here, as it seems i do with everything...

My dad served in the military for years. Small arms Specialist, Demolitions Specialist, Jump Specialist, Medic. Needless to say, he was a very valuable asset to his team.

He told me stories of how back in his day in basic, the Drill Sergeant didn't just yell at you for fucking up. They would kick the shit outta you back then. It was all done to make you buck up, as there was no other option in military then.

Now, after hearing that, basic would seem to be a cake walk. I can handle getting yelled at.

Now, as to all the people saying that this guy is what makes the military a clusterfuck or whatever, then you are a dumbass. Our military is what stands in the way of all the people that want to blow us up. Lets face it, if you did one of their training excercises with those chalk bullets with some military, your getting get screwed.

I believe it was bullets or someone that said to Grobbin to go shoot up some afghanistan civvies for our freedom and to make it so we can make oil rigs and stuff over there. To whomever said that, then go screw yourself man. The military takes civilian casualities into consideration. They dont go around shooting innocent civilians in the streets. And if they do, then they have a good reason, god damnit...

The military has a job; To ensure the freedom and safety of the American civilian is upheld against all opposing forces. Or something like that.

Bottom line, if it weren't for the military, then we would have been dead long ago.

[PhelanKA]

Originally Posted by Malinrol [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

He told me stories of how back in his day in basic, the Drill Sergeant didn't just yell at you for fucking up. They would kick the shit outta you back then. It was all done to make you buck up, as there was no other option in military then.

Your dad's either full of shit or his drill sergeant should've been reported to his superiors and drummed out of the service. Either way drill sergeants have never been permitted to strike a recruit in anger unless that recruit is a danger to himself or his unit (ie - being dangerously violent). Fact.

[Humerox]

Originally Posted by PhelanKA [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Your dad's either full of shit or his drill sergeant should've been reported to his superiors and drummed out of the service. Either way drill sergeants have never been permitted to strike a recruit in anger unless that recruit is a danger to himself or his unit (ie - being dangerously violent). Fact.

Umm...ok. Even in the 70's drills could kick the shit out of ya, and ya best not say nothin' about it either.

Anyway... /salute to the young men and women in uniform.

[Loke]

One of the main reasons I joined the military was to protect and defend my fellow Americans.

One of the main reasons I got out of the military was that I realized that most Americans are unappreciative and thus undeserving of the aforementioned protection. Seriously, I feel absolutely no kinship to 99% of the people in this nation and really couldn't care less about their well-being now.

[rioisk]

Originally Posted by Malinrol [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The military takes civilian casualities into consideration. They dont go around shooting innocent civilians in the streets. And if they do, then they have a good reason, god damnit...

All I know is of the several friends that have been in the military that Iraq is basically a FFA rape and murder zone for US soldiers. They got out ASAP.

[Loke]

Originally Posted by rioisk [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

All I know is of the several friends that have been in the military that Iraq is basically a FFA rape and murder zone for US soldiers. They got out ASAP.

Your friends are probably full of shit. I personally have spent a considerable amount of time in some of the worst parts of Iraq, and even then, it wasn't FFA. Sure, you can take some creative liberties with the RoI - but some people who have you believe that the entire country is like a modern day Mai Lai.

My experience has been that 99% of people who come home and tell war stories are full of shit and telling fairy tales - because most people that do have real war stories don't want to or feel the need to talk about it with friends/family/random people who weren't there and thus wouldn't understand it in a way that would make it worth talking about.

[Stickyfingers]

Originally Posted by Loke [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Your friends are probably full of shit. I personally have spent a considerable amount of time in some of the worst parts of Iraq, and even then, it wasn't FFA. Sure, you can take some creative liberties with the RoI - but some people who have you believe that the entire country is like a modern day Mai Lai.

My experience has been that 99% of people who come home and tell war stories are full of shit and telling fairy tales - because most people that do have real war stories don't want to or feel the need to talk about it with friends/family/random people who weren't there and thus wouldn't understand it in a way that would make it worth talking about.

Agreed. My neighbor was a Sniper in Fallujah during some of the really intense portions of the war, when Fallujah was a real hot bed. I asked him about it, and he didn't want to talk about it and just said it was crazy.

[MiRo2]

Originally Posted by rioisk [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

All I know is of the several friends that have been in the military that Iraq is basically a FFA rape and murder zone for US soldiers. They got out ASAP.

I did two tours in Iraq as a medic in Calvary and Infantry platoons, and can most certainly say, your "several friends" in the "military" are full of shit. Even the idea of this wasn't tolerated. In the 27 months I spent in Iraq, I only ever heard of one rape, and in that case, their entire command was relieved over it even though it was actions of 3 soldiers alone.