Drama

[soup]

Let's make an example thats on a larger and more grand scale of how the fact that they made an agreement SHOULD be what everyone is looking at.

Say there's only two guilds that are ever killing the raid bosses, such as Nagafen and Vox. We'll call them guild A and guild B. Say Nagafen spawns and both guilds converge at once, with no one having an obvious rightful claim over the other to the spawn. Say they come to an agreement, guild A will get Nagafen right now, but in return guild A will let guild B kill Vox next spawn. Now say 12 hours later Vox spawns and guild A rolls into an empty permafrost and kills Vox. Server rules allow this 100%, but guild A would certainly be douche bags of the highest caliber for doing that. You could spam server rules all you wont, they would still be worthless douche bags. (don't try to interpret this the wrong way, I'm not trying to imply any guilds in question are douche bags or blahblah, it's just a hypothetical example)

[Alawen Everywhere]

Originally Posted by YendorLootmonkey [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Let me help you understand:





Step 1: Group wipes, enchanter invokes rule 1 & 4 to claim the camp.

Step 2: Cut a hole in a box.

Step 3: Camp belongs to enchanter. No one is disputing this, even the group leader.

Step 4: Put your junk in that box.

Step 5: Enchanter zones, group invokes rule 1 to claim the camp, just as was done to them.

(Note: rule 1 does not have an arbitrary time limit that you are now "making up" to suit your argument here. They could also invoke rule 4, but we've decided we'll even give the OP benefit of the doubt and assume he could have demonstrated the ability to hold the camp had he killed the pet and re-charmed, or mez/memblurred the pet, waited for the mob to regain HP, and re-charmed. However, in this case, rule 1 was enough for the group to claim the camp.)

Step 6: Make her open the box.

Step 7: Camp belongs to group. "Deal" made to give him 1 PH/spawn is now void.

Loling for several minutes about this post. Thanks Yendor [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[soup]

Originally Posted by YendorLootmonkey [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

More like:

Step 1: make an agreement because you now have rights the camp with the group that previously had rights to the camp
Step 2: lose rights to the camp by zoning
Step 3: cry

Why is it a douchebag move to take a camp after the guy camping it zones for 30 seconds, but not a douchebag move to move in on a camp while the group camping it previously made a mistake, wiped, and are on CR? I mean, exp loss and the corpse run are bad enough, now some douchebag is kicking them in the teeth by taking their camp, too! See, it works both ways... so all we have after all that subjective "who's the bigger douchebag here?" shit-slinging are the fairly objective rules.

And since you're all about throwing out hypothetical situations, who's to say they had full ability to hold the camp, but wiped because someone trained shit on them?

My group moved in on GY in Mistmoore Friday night after the previous group there wiped. Full spawn. I felt bad about it, but by the server rules, they couldn't hold the camp and did not retain their presence there. I was not going to argue with my group about it, and I wasn't going to lose any sleep over it. Those of us who try to avoid being perceived as douchebags 100% of the time would get walked all over by everyone else, and still be level 10 with banded armor if we didn't stick up for ourselves, especially in the overcamped zones on the server.

The douche baggery is pretty easy to measure based on knowledge of the situation either party had while they were doing what they were doing. The enchanter came up to a fully spawned camp, and began clearing it with (presumably) no knowledge that a group had wiped there and was corpse running. He just sees a full spawn with no one around, so it appears to be an open camp. Once they explain the situation to him he says alright, what if I just kill the next PH then hand it back over, sound fair? And they agree.

On the flipside, when the group moved in on the "empty camp" that was now almost fully cleared, they were 100% aware of the enchanter and the deal they had made, but tossed it all aside.

[Alawen Everywhere]

I'm really curious about something here. How many of the people on the pro-solo enchanter side of this argument play an enchanter or a necromancer?

[soup]

So I dunno, clearing a fully spawned camp with no apparent signs of anyone camping it and then offering it back to the group after 1 round of spawns
OR
Making a deal to let someone kill the round of spawns but just moving in and killing it all anyway when the enchanter is gone for a few seconds.

pretty tough call on what the real douche baggery is!

BTW if they really placed any merit at ALL in their deal they had made they would have asked the enchanter what he was doing instead of just trucking on in.

It really all just comes down to whether or not you place any value on your word and any agreements you make with it.

[Alawen Everywhere]

Originally Posted by soup [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The douche baggery is pretty easy to measure based on knowledge of the situation either party had while they were doing what they were doing. The enchanter came up to a fully spawned camp, and began clearing it with (presumably) no knowledge that a group had wiped there and was corpse running. He just sees a full spawn with no one around, so it appears to be an open camp. Once they explain the situation to him he says alright, what if I just kill the next PH then hand it back over, sound fair? And they agree.

On the flipside, when the group moved in on the "empty camp" that was now almost fully cleared, they were 100% aware of the enchanter and the deal they had made, but tossed it all aside.

You can never know the motivations of any individual. This is the same error in reason that leads to corruption in legal systems and stupid ideas like "hate crimes". Only the rule of law can deliver impartial justice.

[Alawen Everywhere]

Originally Posted by soup [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

So I dunno, clearing a fully spawned camp with no apparent signs of anyone camping it and then offering it back to the group after 1 round of spawns
OR
Making a deal to let someone kill the round of spawns but just moving in and killing it all anyway when the enchanter is gone for a few seconds.

pretty tough call on what the real douche baggery is!

BTW if they really placed any merit at ALL in their deal they had made they would have asked the enchanter what he was doing instead of just trucking on in.

It really all just comes down to whether or not you place any value on your word and any agreements you make with it.

They kept their word. He had his opportunity. He failed.

[Stepy]

I play a Necromancer and do not side with this enchanter, unless they all had corpses summoned or dragged to a safe place they should have been seen by the Enchanter.
I'm would believe they would agree to let him have his ONE ph to give them time to buff and med for next respawn.

[soup]

Originally Posted by Alawen Everywhere [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

They kept their word. He had his opportunity. He failed.

Except for the part where they didn't even let him engage the mob, rofl

[Alawen Everywhere]

Originally Posted by soup [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Except for the part where they didn't even let him engage the mob, rofl

Except for the part WHERE HE LEFT THE FUCKING ZONE. He failed. You play a solo class, don't you?