Raid Changes

[Daldolma]

Poop-socking is far better for server health than one mega-guild dominating content by perma-tracking 96 hour windows and having 30 raiders available at any time of any day. But poop-socking could be solved, too. Instead of the silly "first raid force" rule that resulted in hours upon hours of poop-socking, just make it FTE. It will take guilds 30 minutes to arrive, buff, and wait on a pop. Every guild that wants a shot can show up and pray for FTE, same as everyone else. After a few weeks of that absolute misery, you'd have a rotation.

It absolutely would alleviate the dominance of the top guilds, by the way, if implemented by FTE rather than first raid force. TMO can be as big and mobile and "determined" as they want. If 150 people from 5 different guilds are sitting on VS's spawn point hoping for FTE, TMO's odds are pretty crappy relative to the 90% they're claiming now. Ditto for every other mob.

Obviously that scenario would be an absolute mess, but that's the point. Things have to get bad before they can get better. EQ Classic raiding worked because everyone had the power to make life miserable for everyone else unless there was at least some degree of cooperation. That created a community. The current rules minimize friction and make GMs' lives easier, but they do that by creating a bastardized version of EQ raiding. Most raid mobs are uncontested because the current rules just threw progressively more ridiculous obstacles in the way of raid mobs until only one guild was willing to keep trying.

I don't see what the issue would be with classic variance and FTE rules. If you're worried about disputes, implement a FTE-shout. I don't understand how there can be any disagreement that the current raiding scene is broken. There's only one raiding guild, and they had 77 members at an uncontested raid last night. Does that sound classic to anyone?

[Splorf22]

Originally Posted by Daldolma [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Poop-socking is far better for server health than one mega-guild dominating content by perma-tracking 96 hour windows and having 30 raiders available at any time of any day. But poop-socking could be solved, too. Instead of the silly "first raid force" rule that resulted in hours upon hours of poop-socking, just make it FTE. It will take guilds 30 minutes to arrive, buff, and wait on a pop. Every guild that wants a shot can show up and pray for FTE, same as everyone else. After a few weeks of that absolute misery, you'd have a rotation.

This is actually a pretty reasonable idea; I'm surprised no one has pointed this out before.

All things being equal though I think racing is more fun than rotations. Its just that racing in the same zone doesn't work very well.

[Asher]

Originally Posted by Daldolma [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Poop-socking is far better for server health than one mega-guild dominating content by perma-tracking 96 hour windows and having 30 raiders available at any time of any day. But poop-socking could be solved, too. Instead of the silly "first raid force" rule that resulted in hours upon hours of poop-socking, just make it FTE. It will take guilds 30 minutes to arrive, buff, and wait on a pop. Every guild that wants a shot can show up and pray for FTE, same as everyone else. After a few weeks of that absolute misery, you'd have a rotation.

It absolutely would alleviate the dominance of the top guilds, by the way, if implemented by FTE rather than first raid force. TMO can be as big and mobile and "determined" as they want. If 150 people from 5 different guilds are sitting on VS's spawn point hoping for FTE, TMO's odds are pretty crappy relative to the 90% they're claiming now. Ditto for every other mob.

Obviously that scenario would be an absolute mess, but that's the point. Things have to get bad before they can get better. EQ Classic raiding worked because everyone had the power to make life miserable for everyone else unless there was at least some degree of cooperation. That created a community. The current rules minimize friction and make GMs' lives easier, but they do that by creating a bastardized version of EQ raiding. Most raid mobs are uncontested because the current rules just threw progressively more ridiculous obstacles in the way of raid mobs until only one guild was willing to keep trying.

I don't see what the issue would be with classic variance and FTE rules. If you're worried about disputes, implement a FTE-shout. I don't understand how there can be any disagreement that the current raiding scene is broken. There's only one raiding guild, and they had 77 members at an uncontested raid last night. Does that sound classic to anyone?

Well said.

Asher

[Sweetbaby Jesus]

Originally Posted by Daldolma [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Poop-socking is far better for server health than one mega-guild dominating content by perma-tracking 96 hour windows and having 30 raiders available at any time of any day. But poop-socking could be solved, too. Instead of the silly "first raid force" rule that resulted in hours upon hours of poop-socking, just make it FTE. It will take guilds 30 minutes to arrive, buff, and wait on a pop. Every guild that wants a shot can show up and pray for FTE, same as everyone else. After a few weeks of that absolute misery, you'd have a rotation. It absolutely would alleviate the dominance of the top guilds, by the way, if implemented by FTE rather than first raid force. TMO can be as big and mobile and "determined" as they want. If 150 people from 5 different guilds are sitting on VS's spawn point hoping for FTE, TMO's odds are pretty crappy relative to the 90% they're claiming now. Ditto for every other mob. Obviously that scenario would be an absolute mess, but that's the point. Things have to get bad before they can get better. EQ Classic raiding worked because everyone had the power to make life miserable for everyone else unless there was at least some degree of cooperation. That created a community. The current rules minimize friction and make GMs' lives easier, but they do that by creating a bastardized version of EQ raiding. Most raid mobs are uncontested because the current rules just threw progressively more ridiculous obstacles in the way of raid mobs until only one guild was willing to keep trying. I don't see what the issue would be with classic variance and FTE rules. If you're worried about disputes, implement a FTE-shout. I don't understand how there can be any disagreement that the current raiding scene is broken. There's only one raiding guild, and they had 77 members at an uncontested raid last night. Does that sound classic to anyone?

This is exactly what I've been trying to get across. It'll be a huge mess at first but it wouldn't take long for the players to get sick of it and work together to make the things better.

[arsenalpow]

If you want change boycott TMO.

Do not heal, buff, rez, port, buy-from, sell-to, communicate-with anyone that is tagged TMO. Period. Anytime you help TMO in any way you are condoning their attitude towards the rest of the server and the unethical actions they take.

Let TMO sustain themselves as a separate entity apart from the rest of the p99 community because TMO has no use for the rest of us.

Every. Single. Guild. On the server is willing to come to the table for the betterment of the server, except TMO. That speaks for itself.

Some of you may counter with "we'll not everyone in TMO is a dbag" and that's a perfectly true statement, but those upstanding individuals don't challenge their own leadership when shady shit happens. Staying silent to preserve the status quo (keeping the pixels flowing) is all that matters to them, the rest of us can fuck off. So you want to experience Veeshan's Peak? Gotta kill Trak first, good luck with that. Even if TMO wipes at Trak and your guild does kill it they FTE rules lawyer you out of the kill. Even if you do get enough keys to mount a VP force TMO can always legally train your raid. Yes, VP is a no GM interference zone, they can literally train the piss out of you so you can never raid in VP, the only recourse is to train them back, feel free to stoop to their despicable level.

BDA is willing to help anyone (except TMO, they don't need anyone but themselves) kill anything in our power, just get in contact with an officer and we'll arrange a time to assist. See you in Norrath.

[Lostprophets]

Originally Posted by arsenalpow [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

TLDR;

I disagree with every statement you just wrote about TMO, if you have issues there check ur current guild roster and their past history with TMO.

TMO has offered plenty of people Childs tears for their shaman epics, Rotting fear loot, hell, Eccezan even invited me to kill Sev with them one day. TMO might be holding the ropes as top guild and get all the loot now, but they aren't a bad bunch if you get to know them, and not be dicks to them. the variance system is the problem, not them.

However, that's not even the issue here so please don't bring flaming into this thread, this is a serious matter..take that garb to RnF.

[Asher]

Originally Posted by Lostprophets [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I disagree with every statement you just wrote about TMO, if you have issues there check ur current guild roster and their past history with TMO.

TMO has offered plenty of people Childs tears for their shaman epics, Rotting fear loot, hell, Eccezan even invited me to kill Sev with them one day. TMO might be holding the ropes as top guild and get all the loot now, but they aren't a bad bunch if you get to know them, and not be dicks to them. the variance system is the problem, not them.

However, that's not even the issue here so please don't bring flaming into this thread, this is a serious matter..take that garb to RnF.

You think they would be as nice to us if they felt threatened by us? They know Taken is small so they don't mind throwing us a small bone once and awhile. If we were BDAs size I think things would be different.

Asher

[arsenalpow]

Originally Posted by Lostprophets [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I disagree with every statement you just wrote, if you have issues there check ur current guild roster and their past history with TMO.

TMO has offered plenty of people Childs tears for their shaman epics, Rotting fear loot, hell, Eccezan even invited me to kill Sev with them one day. TMO might be holding the ropes as top guild and get all the loot now, but they aren't a bad bunch if you get to know them, and not be dicks to them. the variance system is the problem, not them.

However, that's not even the issue here so please don't bring flaming into this thread, this is a serious matter..take that garb to RnF.

I appreciate that a serious conversation attempted to spawn from this thread but Sirken and Rogean already weighed in haven't they? Logically we should turn our attention to something more feasible. A rotation with specific rules would fix this entirely and I'm willing to bet every single guild would agree except for TMO.

Rotate between the guilds, give them a 30min timer to engage and then it turns into FTE. TMO would still get every single non prime time kill because no one else has the ability to field numbers like they do and the other guilds would at least have a shot at content.

Regarding your relations with TMO, I'm happy that you've experienced the better side, but don't come between any loot they are actively chasing, you'll see a much different side of them.

[Ilakje]

Originally Posted by arsenalpow [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

A rotation with specific rules would fix this entirely and I'm willing to bet every single guild would agree except for TMO.

I'm willing to bet every single person in this country would vote to split Oprah's millions evenly except for Oprah. She must be the bad guy. Boycott Oprah imo.

[Llabak]

Originally Posted by Ilakje [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'm willing to bet every single person in this country would vote to split Oprah's millions evenly except for Oprah. She must be the bad guy. Boycott Oprah imo.

This is only accurate if a) Wealth were truly zero sum; and b) Oprah would go to entrepreneurs trying to generate wealth and file legal injunctions against them, or perhaps burn down their businesses.

A better example would perhaps be Microsoft's monopoly of the browser market last decade based upon the fact that 99% of the world's computers ran Windows. I believe the courts concluded they were, in fact, the bad guys, and forced them to change their policies.