Who lays claim?

[Beau]

cant just let the players duke it out themselves? do they really lack that much of a real social life that they have to control every little thing in their little pirated felonious illegal world they made

In Classic EQ, Gm's really couldn't intervene like they do here on player agree'd raid rotations/rules. The only thing they could do is check logs to confirm who first engaged and who attempted ks/ninja, if that were the problem.

Any sort of player made rules was on honor system and enforced in one way or another by the players. At least on my server.

[Beau]

More on that...

The argument in live classic was, player made rules were generally agreed upon by a group of players, not ALL players, outside of the game on a player administered webpage that was not outlined as a game requirement in the eula.

Technically, it is NOT classic for a GM to intervene for clarification, punishment or "deathtouching the raid and despawning the mob." The Gm can watch to make sure it's pulled, killed and looted fairly. But to enforced player agreed rules is not legit .

I really love this server , And really love what you guys are trying to do here, but thats just a gross abuse of power, and far far from classic ruling. You ban people for ninjalooting, kiting trains, stealing established pulls, and many other reasons. Not for having the first force to kill a mob (first force to kill is first to engage. if you can sit there for 20 minutes and cant pull it first, you cant kill it)

Thats just my two cents, feel free to flame away if you disagree. I just think this current system is really silly.

[Aeolwind]

Originally Posted by Beau [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Technically, it is NOT classic for a GM to intervene for clarification, punishment or "deathtouching the raid and despawning the mob." The Gm can watch to make sure it's pulled, killed and looted fairly. But to enforced player agreed rules is not legit .

Not entirely true. On Emarr Uini had finally had enough of a guild called Ebonlore, she disbanded the guild, banned Ewle the guild leader & made a serverwide announcement regarding that fact. This is amongst the long list of things that Uini did, among them were depopping mobs, death touching guild leaders & banning players.

On several occasions on Emarr player "enforced" rotations were upheld and maintained by the GM's, and I remember it occurring on a few other servers as well.

[Beau]

I've seen gm's fired for that.~

[Evorix]

can't get fired if you own the server

[Beau]

Originally Posted by Evorix [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

can't get fired if you own the server

Right but thats kinda the point...

[Beau]

Nilbog has made it very clear he is a true classicist. That means at some point they need to back off and let the players handle the raid disputes amongst themselves. This is not a programming issue that takes time to fix or figure out a bug or glitch, its a moral/judgement issue. "When can we back off and let the players handle their own problems."

If a mob is bugged, thats where the gm's intervene. If a guild trains , uses vulgarity, ninjaloots or Attempts/succeeds and kill steal, thats where gm intervenes. If players break their own rules, that's their own honor, and there are ways of handling it.

If i make a new guild tomorrow would they be subject to these rules? They had no part in making or agreeing to them. So technically they are not a part of it.

Like I said before ... Silly. Childish and silly.

[Olorin]

Originally Posted by Aeolwind [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Not entirely true. On Emarr Uini had finally had enough of a guild called Ebonlore, she disbanded the guild, banned Ewle the guild leader & made a serverwide announcement regarding that fact. This is amongst the long list of things that Uini did, among them were depopping mobs, death touching guild leaders & banning players.

On several occasions on Emarr player "enforced" rotations were upheld and maintained by the GM's, and I remember it occurring on a few other servers as well.

Hehe -- Ebonlore, the only guild (that im aware of) to get banned on every mmo they've played on.