TMO declares Gorenaire an endangered species!

[Stealin Dragons]

Originally Posted by Lazortag [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

No. That is not what most people here want. We want to see content we've never seen before, revisit content we have seen, and earn our loot through fair competition. I would rather get one mob on a simultaneous respawn than 5 mobs on a rotation, because the former has to be earned (since it requires you to mobilize and takes some semblance of skill to accomplish). It's not like p99's raid scene has to be one extreme (rotations) or the other (ridiculously long variances). There's a happy middle that's still competitive and accessible to people who aren't chained to their keyboards.

I said most, not all.

However, most of the fantasy scenarios that people wish of the raiding scene are just as unlikely.

Wanting non-rotations but want hours to engage.

Wanting to have other guilds back off just because you were the first to port a group to the zone. (how is this any different than snagging FTE?)

Wanting shots at mobs without a variance, without poopsocking and without having to log in randomly.

There are a great deal of things people want that either have bad consequences or just aren't well thought out.

[falkun]

Originally Posted by Stealin Dragons [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I said most, not all.

However, most of the fantasy scenarios that people wish of the raiding scene are just as unlikely.

Wanting non-rotations but want hours to engage.

Wanting to have other guilds back off just because you were the first to port a group to the zone. (how is this any different than snagging FTE?)

Wanting shots at mobs without a variance, without poopsocking and without having to log in randomly.

There are a great deal of things people want that either have bad consequences or just aren't well thought out.

They are only unlikely because people/players refuse to behave civilly towards one another. It's an "I want my pixels NAOW" mentality. There will, and have been, times when every guild was fairly beaten to a mob/zone, and the other guild leapfrogged them. Nilbog said its a dick move, but since it is still within the server rules, its allowed to happen. The only thing unreasonable about a more civil raid environment is the parties involved, all of us, refuse to act as such.

And Geigue does not champion the idea of "zero variance". He champions the idea of "all 7-day mobs on the same variance, so they all pop at the same time". He, and others, realize that variance in some capacity is a necessary evil to this top-heavy server, but by forcing competing forces to pick their targets, instead of having them pop one at a time, will allow different guilds to mobilize for different targets. At least that's how I understand the "simulated patch day" (hereafter SPD) pop philosophy, please correct me if I'm wrong Giegue. He also admits that a large portion of the mobs would still go to the top tier guild(s), but by focusing on a single target, or a few select targets, the smaller guild(s) could kill their focused targets while the top guild(s) focus theirs and cannot divert resources to the other targets.

Going over your list again:

Originally Posted by Stealin Dragons [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Wanting non-rotations but want hours to engage. -- SPD does not give you more time than your competition allows, but forces guilds to focus on desired targets

Wanting to have other guilds back off just because you were the first to port a group to the zone. (how is this any different than snagging FTE?) -- SPD would encourage guilds to not compete so that the early targets are slain faster so they can move onto the next target

Wanting shots at mobs without a variance, without poopsocking and without having to log in randomly. -- SPD still has variance, and people will still have to log in randomly, just not ALL the time, but ALL at once

[Lazortag]

That's mostly what I think, although you spelled my name wrong the first time around. I'm used to it, it's okay.

I think simultaneous respawns could be done in a number of ways and it would be great if there was some sort of official discussion about that, perhaps in the raid guild forum.

[Stealin Dragons]

Originally Posted by falkun [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

They are only unlikely because people/players refuse to behave civilly towards one another. It's an "I want my pixels NAOW" mentality. There will, and have been, times when every guild was fairly beaten to a mob/zone, and the other guild leapfrogged them. Nilbog said its a dick move, but since it is still within the server rules, its allowed to happen. The only thing unreasonable about a more civil raid environment is the parties involved, all of us, refuse to act as such.

And Geigue does not champion the idea of "zero variance". He champions the idea of "all 7-day mobs on the same variance, so they all pop at the same time". He, and others, realize that variance in some capacity is a necessary evil to this top-heavy server, but by forcing competing forces to pick their targets, instead of having them pop one at a time, will allow different guilds to mobilize for different targets. At least that's how I understand the "simulated patch day" (hereafter SPD) pop philosophy, please correct me if I'm wrong Giegue. He also admits that a large portion of the mobs would still go to the top tier guild(s), but by focusing on a single target, or a few select targets, the smaller guild(s) could kill their focused targets while the top guild(s) focus theirs and cannot divert resources to the other targets.

Going over your list again:

I've already agreed that a simulated patch day would help.

That doesn't address the overall P99 raiding scene. It only allows the causal guilds a means to possibly snag a target in the chaos.

You are referring to 2 different situations. Unless you want all raid targets to spawn at the same time once a week, thus changing the entire way they spawn currently.

[Tiggles]

I don't like SPD because if someone is at work or unable to log in he missed the entire weeks worth of mobs.

SPD is good once and a while but for it to be a once a week thing is too much.

[Lazortag]

Originally Posted by Tiggles [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't like SPD because if someone is at work or unable to log in he missed the entire weeks worth of mobs.

SPD is good once and a while but for it to be a once a week thing is too much.

Two responses. Firstly, there's still 3-day spawns. Secondly, that's classic - in 1999 if a patch day happened while you were at work, you didn't get to see mobs that week. Since mobs had no variance they spawned at roughly the same time anyway, so again, if you were busy on the day they spawned you weren't going to get anything.

Moreover, the casual guilds miss the "entire week's worth of mobs" almost every week under the current system. I just fail to see how this could be worse.

[falkun]

Originally Posted by Tiggles [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't like SPD because if someone is at work or unable to log in he missed the entire weeks worth of mobs.

SPD is good once and a while but for it to be a once a week thing is too much.

And yet those who work jobs and have families are not able to get anything ever because the individual mob variance allows the top guild(s) to monopolize the content. Neither is a perfect solution for every person, but your argument against SPD is the exact same argument that others use against the current implementation, "because I have to work or am unable to log in [5 minutes after mob spawn], I missed the entire weeks worth of mobs."

And who knows, maybe something will still be up by the time you get off work 5 hours later? I know when TMO and IB were on VP-lock, Gore, Vox, and Naggy at least were left up for hours. Also, when TMO and IB were raid suspended, Talendor was also left up for what, over 2 hours?

[EDIT]....and what Giegue said.

[Lorraine]

Originally Posted by Tiggles [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't like SPD because if someone is at work or unable to log in he missed the entire weeks worth of mobs.

SPD is good once and a while but for it to be a once a week thing is too much.

Pleanty of 1-5manable epic mobs that are on 3d and some on 7d timers still in game. Right now due to variance there's a lot of misinformation regarding these. People are forced to either camp them personaly (and sometimes camp them just to get a time of death) or hope to get lucky / have 3-4 available for em etc.