VS Remains & 'summoned' Fay

[Lazortag]

Originally Posted by YendorLootmonkey [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think it might be a troll because:

1) a rez clicky is the single most valuable epic to a guild that raids

2) a druid is not sitting there clicking air trying to turn in a quest item first with X other clerics

Thus, it made sense to work together and hash out a Ragefire rotation.

Yeah, a lot of the other epics have bottlenecks of 96-hour window mobs too. The frustration is also created because EVERYONE WANTS THEIR EPIC NOW NOW NOW, and we know exactly what to turn in where in order to get them, whereas in Live this took weeks/months to figure out in some cases.

Right, I see your point - clicking air for a 72 hours is a ridiculous waste of time when it's essentially random who "wins", so it should be rotated. I just feel that competition over VS has gotten absurd in a similar way - seeing 30 people from a single guild in zone at all times is kind of discouraging for anyone wanting a shot at the mob (especially since it's also an epic mob). When it gets closer to the end of VS's window the poopsocking gets even worse. This is probably more of a reason that the raid rules need to be changed than it is a reason to rotate, but still I think you can see our frustration.

And I know this is a bit unrelated, but it's bad for the project as a whole to only have two guilds engaging most of the content since that means less people can report problems with the encounters. I know that it wasn't until our first attempt on VS that anyone reported the bug with rune not stopping innate procs. Supposedly before then his lifetap was resistable, which is also really bad and wasn't reported until more guilds started getting attempts on him. I'm not saying VD or TMO purposely keeps bugs secret, just that when less people experience the content, less people can report problems with it. That's just a fact.

[Slave]

This statement is false:

Originally Posted by Lazortag [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

it's bad for the project as a whole to only have two guilds engaging most of the content since that means less people can report problems with the encounters.

The following statement, while true, has nothing to do with the above quotation whatsoever:

Originally Posted by Lazortag [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

when less people experience the content, less people can report problems with it. That's just a fact.

Guilds are not monolithic entities... they are made up of people. The most successful guilds are generally the largest guilds. The largest guilds have the most people in it, by definition. And as we all know, when more people experience the content, more people can report problems with it.

[Lazortag]

I think you're going to have to explain yourself a little better. If only two guilds are experiencing the high end content, then less people are experiencing the content than if those two guilds plus another guild were experiencing it. Even if those guilds are very large and can cover most of the bugs related to a raid mob, history has shown this isn't always enough (see the example I gave in my previous post). The more people able to report bugs with raid encounters, the better.

[Slave]

Originally Posted by Lazortag [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think you're going to have to explain yourself a little better. If only two guilds are experiencing the high end content, then less people are experiencing the content than if those two guilds plus another guild were experiencing it. Even if those guilds are very large and can cover most of the bugs related to a raid mob, history has shown this isn't always enough (see the example I gave in my previous post). The more people able to report bugs with raid encounters, the better.

The number of guilds experiencing content is not absolutely tied to the number of players experiencing content, because there is no maximum on the number of players per guild. It seems more like you're complaining that your guild isn't as powerful as the others and can't compete for spawns under the current ruleset than anything.

[Kope]

Originally Posted by Slave [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Guilds are not monolithic entities... they are made up of people. The most successful guilds are generally the largest guilds. The largest guilds have the most people in it, by definition. And as we all know, when more people experience the content, more people can report problems with it.

This logic has flaws in it. Peace Pipe wasn't one of the strongest raiding guilds when they were in their prime.

It's not just pure numbers that are needed, there's a quality of player that is needed.