PvP Range

[Softcore PK]

I don't understand the FFA zones. Won't the dynamic system make up for this?

[Macken]

No matter what lies are offered up to placate those who already know the dynamic system is crap, all will have to deal with the fallout: delayed launch, exploitation of the dynamic system, bugs weeks, months and years into the future, etc....




6-50 or you wear panties.

[Sarkov]

Originally Posted by Macken [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

6-50 or you wear panties.

SISSY. Make it 1-50. Epic piles of corpses at every newbie spawn point in every newbie zone.

Part of the fun of pvp servers is taking your licks when you're a lowbie. That makes it oh-so-much-sweeter when you get to go pwnz crushbone 50 levels later.

[Null]

Originally Posted by Macken [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

No matter what lies are offered up to placate those who already know the dynamic system is crap, all will have to deal with the fallout: delayed launch, exploitation of the dynamic system, bugs weeks, months and years into the future, etc....

6-50 or you wear panties.

Other than assumptions of developer incompetence, why do you dislike the dynamic system?

[rankorr]

can we have FFA in the following zones please?


Permafrost
Sol-b
Lguk
kedge
planes

and later on..

hole
karnor
seb
HS
chardok
VP

[Macken]

Originally Posted by Null [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Other than assumptions of developer incompetence, why do you dislike the dynamic system?

Null,

The answer to that would be obvious to anyone who has pvp'd longer than 12 months. Do you have any pvp experience? What exactly are your credentials?


I know nothing of coding, that is the only reason i haven't launched a full fledged propoganda attack on your ass. The staff has exploded an A-bomb on the community moral.

Why must the staff continue to push non-classic and unwanted changes catered to the exact segment of the population that isn't attracted to pvp, while alienating those who are your exact target population?

Have you suggested to get rid of pve on p99 too? Why would you restrict pve on p99? Why would you restrict pvp on R99?

You coded +/- 7 (or someone did) on VZTZ and you couldn't find any pvp at all. There wasn't anyone in range. You log on. Check /who all. See no one. Log off. Server died. Going to go even faster with no /who all to check---Log on. check zone, check next zone over, check next zone after that, see people, waste time running over to find out they are all green. Get disgusted. Log off. Post on forums i told you so. Server dies.

Do you really need another History lesson?

I told you and your staff on VZTZ that pvp rules where counter productive and a misallocation of resources. Half a year later you quit over it and so did every other GM. Even Sirken finally figured it out and had enough guts to get rid of anti-pvp rules.

This is a pvp server yes? Everyone is expected to be over age 5 yes? On a game where the object is to KILL, we aren't going to coddle those who cry that they are being killed yes?

Is it safe to say if you had left well enough alone and just flipped the pvp switch that we would all be closer to the precious?

[Null]

Macken,

You didn't really answer my question, or if you did answer it I couldn't read between the trolling enough to pick it out. So if I miss anything you wanted answered, please try and reform the question as plain as possible.

Originally Posted by Macken [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Null,
The answer to that would be obvious to anyone who has pvp'd longer than 12 months. Do you have any pvp experience? What exactly are your credentials?

Played EQ from late classic until whatever expansion came 5-6 years later on TZ. I remember being aggravated because the PvP part of the game was generally an afterthought and many changes were made for the sake of PvE that crippled PvP eventually. I then worked and eventually ran the highest populated eqemu pvp server (I think ever?)....

Originally Posted by Macken [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I told you and your staff on VZTZ that pvp rules where counter productive and a misallocation of resources. Half a year later you quit over it and so did every other GM. Even Sirken finally figured it out and had enough guts to get rid of anti-pvp rules.

Do you really need another History lesson?

...we then held that population for the most part until the staff imploded because the person hosting our server (only when his girlfriend didn't need the power outlet for her hair drier) refused to stop interacting with our population in less than professional ways. At that point I quit and the server changed hands. Most of the code on the server that I had contributed was removed out of spite, and the server eventually died.

Originally Posted by Macken [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Why must the staff continue to push non-classic and unwanted changes catered to the exact segment of the population that isn't attracted to pvp, while alienating those who are your exact target population?

Originally Posted by Macken [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This is a pvp server yes? Everyone is expected to be over age 5 yes? On a game where the object is to KILL, we aren't going to coddle those who cry that they are being killed yes?

If you are talking about PvP Range (since that was what the question was about in the first place) then there is no consensus on what range to go with. I know you want FFA, others want anything between +/-4 and +/-8. This dynamic system is a compromise.

Originally Posted by Macken [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Is it safe to say if you had left well enough alone and just flipped the pvp switch that we would all be closer to the precious?

This is the only question you have in this huge post that doesn't have some sort of snide/douchie/trolling comment in it. I think that is because you are just impatient and need your PvP fix. I really doubt you have any serious issues with the dynamic system outside of the time you perceive it will take work the bugs out of it. It's cool, I get it and I think its great that you are this excited about the server.

To answer your question though:

For just the level range? Sure.

For everything else? No.

[Macken]

Understood.

You aren't going to find many if any people who know more about making it easier on staff to administer pvp policies.

I am merely advocating a no-nonsense, pvp-centric common sense approach.

The more rules you make, the more you will hate GMing, or the more you will shit on the GM's and the more the population will hate you/them. I fully believe that if you are being honest with yourself, you already know this if only from experience. You really need to streamline this anti-pvp on a pvp server nonsense, and cut it to a minimum, or better yet, cut it out altogether for the enjoyment of all.

The more players find themselves in situations where you have tied their hands and refused to give them a chance to resolve their issues under their own power, the more unhappy your playerbase will become. Guess who's number they will be dialing when they all finally figure this out? I'll give you a hint - Not mine. Heres another clue: what do you think the players will do when they find themselves in a situation where you have refused to let them pvp out of it? Take a ride on Reading Railroad. If you pass go, collect $200. I am assuming you are wise enough to already know all of this. Is your intention to allow training? If not... well you might want to rethink.

The players who are advocating any different are confused and do not even understand the consequences of their advocacy. If you look closely at who they are, they are obscure no-names from yesteryear who have wrongly believed all these years that they had any real effect either way on their servers.

I was right when i told you to get rid of anti-pvp rules on VZTZ and of course I am right again now.

If you are as qualified as you would like for us to believe, I shouldn't have to explain any of this to you. You should already know it.

You can continue to wrongly meddle in pvp affairs, but you will not be the only one to pay the price.

And yes, let's be clear. I am excited about your sever, and if allowed, I will play. At least until it becomes clear that it isn't a pvp server, and I will begin to look for the real pvp server like everyone else.

[Null]

Originally Posted by Macken [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The more rules you make, the more you will hate GMing, or the more you will shit on the GM's and the more the population will hate you/them. I fully believe that if you are being honest with yourself, you already know this if only from experience. You really need to streamline this anti-pvp on a pvp server nonsense, and cut it to a minimum, or better yet, cut it out altogether for the enjoyment of all.

I agree entirely, but I think the servers proposed rule set reflects that.

Originally Posted by Macken [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The more players find themselves in situations where you have tied their hands and refused to give them a chance to resolve their issues under their own power, the more unhappy your playerbase will become. Guess who's number they will be dialing when they all finally figure this out? I'll give you a hint - Not mine. Heres another clue: what do you think the players will do when they find themselves in a situation where you have refused to let them pvp out of it? Take a ride on Reading Railroad. If you pass go, collect $200. I am assuming you are wise enough to already know all of this. Is your intention to allow training? If not... well you might want to rethink.

I think its sort of funny that preventing training was a pro for the dynamic range in our internal discussion. The idea is that we can catch people training, but we want to prevent situations where people feel the need to train as the only recourse from stuff like OOR Healing or buffing. FFA would do this too, and would be much for effective at combating OOR healing, but you do understand why FFA is not some peoples cup of tea right?

I think that FFA would push more people away faster than it would keep/bring in. I also see the issues with a static range like +/-8, both systems have their issues and can detour a lot of people from playing. The dynamic range that we have (once the flagging issues are handled) solves most all issues found with -/+8 without dipping into the issues that FFA has. If we could flag people for shit talking then I think that would cover all possible reasons that you would want to kill someone outside of your static range.

Originally Posted by Macken [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

And yes, let's be clear. I am excited about your sever, and if allowed, I will play. At least until it becomes clear that it isn't a pvp server, and I will begin to look for the real pvp server like everyone else.

You have not really done anything that would constitute not being able to play that I am aware of. Also you could also start your own real pvp server, not trying to be a dick just saying that to configure your server the way you want it would not take all that much coding knowledge.

[MakeYouMad]

Originally Posted by Null [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Played EQ from late classic until whatever expansion came 5-6 years later on TZ. I remember being aggravated because the PvP part of the game was generally an afterthought and many changes were made for the sake of PvE that crippled PvP eventually.

Actually, PvP balance has always been fine between melees and hybrids. Wizards and necros have always been fine as well. The only real problem was resists getting high enough to make regular nukes useless from classes like druid, mage, enchanter, and cleric.

Therefore, a rational person would apply changes to direct damage resists to fix that problem instead of irrational, across the board changes that result in upgrades to every class that can cast spells (11 out of 14 classes).